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Brant
12-30-2011, 08:12 PM
So me and a buddy of mine have both recently come to the realization that we would like one gun to do it all. Tough shoes to fill, but I'm confident that an intelligently selected combo gun can handle it.

Here's my problem. The majority of potential guns I have seen are .22/.410. I have a problem with this because in general terms, I can bag the same game with either. Throw in a .410 slug and I guess I can handle deer, but that's not very versatile.

Call me brainwashed by the green machine, but I do prefer a .30 caliber bullet. I'm confident that on this continent I can handle most large game with a 30-06, so there's my rifle component. Now for the shotgun. I need something that can handle small game such a grouse and hare, but also get me in the game with waterfowl. I'm leaning towards 20 gauge but really, I am undecided.

After many long debates, usually at the pub, I am still undecided. This is going to be a rather expensive purchase for me and I'd like to get it right. What's your opinion? I'm not thinking along the lines of a survival rifle so ammo constraints don't bother me. If you could take one combo gun into the bush with you, what would it be and why?

camotrash
12-30-2011, 08:23 PM
Savage made an over/under in 30/30-20 gauge that would be dandy. Always wanted one, just never met up with one when I had the money in my pocket. On the other hand, an H&R Handi in 308 win. with a 20 gauge barrel would also be dandy.

Falstaff
12-30-2011, 09:47 PM
Those that have been mentioned would be my choice. I would love to get my hands on a Savage 24 or one of the Baikal over and under. The Handy rifles are great too. They do make the Rossi model in 20 or 12 gauge and several different rifle loads, but like the Handy, you have to switch barrels.

There is a member here who has one of the Handy receivers with 10 different caliber rifle barrels. Makes me green with envy just thinking about it.

mdauben
12-30-2011, 09:58 PM
The majority of potential guns I have seen are .22/.410.
If you search for the OOP Savage Model 24 on the gun auction sites, you can find them in .410, 20ga and even 12ga. The rifle barrels run from .22LR up through .30-30, IIRC. While model 24's in general are not that rare, finding the exact combo you want may be a bit harder, but should be doable.


Call me brainwashed by the green machine, but I do prefer a .30 caliber bullet. I'm confident that on this continent I can handle most large game with a 30-06, so there's my rifle component. Now for the shotgun. I need something that can handle small game such a grouse and hare, but also get me in the game with waterfowl. I'm leaning towards 20 gauge but really, I am undecided.
To find a combo in 20ga, you might need to go with a custom gun (used or new) which could run from $1,000-$10,000 depending on the maker and condition. BRNO makes a combo gun in .30-06/12ga (http://www.cz-usa.com/products/view/brno-combo-rifleshotgun/)that is probably close to what you want. Even for this "production" gun the MSRP is over $2000, however. :17:


If you could take one combo gun into the bush with you, what would it be and why?
I'd probably go with a Savage 24 in .22LR or .22mag and 20ga. With slugs that combo would easily take anything from squirrels to deer.

askari
12-30-2011, 10:04 PM
Go with the Baikal IZH 94.

I have 3 so i am biased but good luck finding one anymore. There used to be a IZH94 "Sever" , 22mag over 20 gauge on Auction Arms but i think the asking price was around $1500. To me that's is in the Valmet or Brno price range.

Hiwa
12-30-2011, 10:09 PM
Hi Brant. My one gun deal is an 870 Rem. 12ga. I carry slugs, buckshot 000 , and #4's. If I'm looking for small game , I load 2 #4's or 7 1/2's followed by 3 slugs in case something ugly comes along that doesn't like me.

My eyesight ain't the best at my age , so I do my shooting close.

If it was to be a rifle , no doubt my old ' 94 Win. in 30-30.

askari
12-30-2011, 10:12 PM
Gunsinternational has an Baikal SP94 in 12 over .06. Asking a little over $550 for it but tack on the obvious transfer fee and s&h.

hunter63
12-30-2011, 10:18 PM
Gunsinternational has an Baikal SP94 in 12 over .06. Asking a little over $550 for it but tack on the obvious transfer fee and s&h.

That really isn't a bad price......Savage m24 go for $400 up.

Last few shows I went to had several, in that range, couple of .22lr over .410, and one .22mag over 20ga.

This it?:
http://www.gunsinternational.com/BAIKAL-MP-94-COMBINATION-GUN.cfm?gun_id=100211201

askari
12-30-2011, 10:29 PM
That really isn't a bad price......Savage m24 go for $400 up.

Last few shows I went to had several, in that range, couple of .22lr over .410, and one .22mag over 20ga.

This it?:
http://www.gunsinternational.com/BAIKAL-MP-94-COMBINATION-GUN.cfm?gun_id=100211201

That's her.

Most of the time the only models i see are the O/U Express version in rifle calibers only.

Taliesin
12-30-2011, 10:36 PM
Rossi makes the Trifecta. It's a single shot .22lr/20ga/.243win.

hunter63
12-30-2011, 10:39 PM
That's her.

Most of the time the only models i see are the O/U Express version in rifle calibers only.

Hummmmm.....don't have one of those....LOL

wsdstan
12-30-2011, 10:48 PM
I am not aware of any combo guns in .30-06 and 20 ga. except perhaps a 3 barrel drilling. I believe Merkel made a .30-06 combined with a 20 gauge, possibly a 12 gauge. That gun isn't going to be inexpensive.

In a down to earth price range you will have to hunt for a Savage 24. The most powerful cartridge they offered in that gun was a .30/30.

You might be better off with the suggested Handi-rifle. You can get a .30-06barrel and add a 12 ga. or 20 ga. It would be pretty versatile and you can get it for less than the Savage Model 24 in .30/30. Food for thought I guess.

Brant
12-30-2011, 10:52 PM
I'm not too concerned about existing combo guns on the market. I have a line on a company out of finland that makes custom combo guns. I was more interested in everyones opinion, given the option of an over/under combo gun, what would be your choice for calibers and why.

hunter63
12-30-2011, 11:00 PM
By your OP, and your stated desire for a .30 cal....and water foul hunting......The 12ga over 30-06 seems a ideal choice......especially in B.C.
IMHO

Dr. Redneck
12-30-2011, 11:09 PM
If you search for the OOP Savage Model 24 on the gun auction sites, you can find them in .410, 20ga and even 12ga. The rifle barrels run from .22LR up through .30-30, IIRC. While model 24's in general are not that rare, finding the exact combo you want may be a bit harder, but should be doable.


To find a combo in 20ga, you might need to go with a custom gun (used or new) which could run from $1,000-$10,000 depending on the maker and condition. BRNO makes a combo gun in .30-06/12ga (http://www.cz-usa.com/products/view/brno-combo-rifleshotgun/)that is probably close to what you want. Even for this "production" gun the MSRP is over $2000, however. :17:


I'd probably go with a Savage 24 in .22LR or .22mag and 20ga. With slugs that combo would easily take anything from squirrels to deer.
yea that CZ is just like you described, but thats alot of money

GreyOne
12-30-2011, 11:16 PM
If going for a custom build, I would tend to think the 308 cartridge preferable to the 30-06 for this project. And I say that as a confirmed 30-06 fan. It is just that the ballisitics are so close as to be functionally the same for hunting, and 308 is a trifle shorter, lighter, and a bit more available in surplus ammo as well.

EdD270
12-30-2011, 11:27 PM
If you can find a Savage in .30-30 over 20 gauge, that would be about ideal, IMHO. But they're scarce for a reason. I think Remington imports a combo gun, or did, but I don't know what it's available in.
Really for a do-all gun, it's hard to beat a regular 20-ga. pump shotgun with a variety of choke tubes and maybe a rifled barrel with reddot or optical sight. With the variety of shot available, from fine rat shot up to buckshot and slugs, it will do anything you need it to do.
A great alternative would be one of the interchangeable barrel single-shots, like the Trifecta already mentioned. With 20-ga, .22 rimfire, and a .270 or .30-06 barrel that would cover it all.

Edz
12-30-2011, 11:58 PM
I have had many of these. Still have a few too. I used to carry a 30-30/12ga savage during the overlapping deer/bird season here in Maine. After I while I just found that to be a little too heavy. Also have owned a .223/20ga which I used for coyotes. Sold that. Had a .22mag/20ga as well that I sold because I just could not get the accuracy I wanted out of the .22mag bbl.
What I am left with is a .357mag/20ga combo. This is probably the closest to a "do it all" gun. They are rare, hard to find and expensive now a days. I will never sell mine! I have 2 .22-410 Stevens combos. They are IMO one of the best all around small game guns there are! I also have a 24C, Savage which is the "camper" model. .22lr/20ga with a shorter bbl than the others and a compartment in the butt stock for ammo. I must admit I have not used that as much as I thought I would. They too seem to be hard to find these days.
Love combos!

edz

mdauben
12-31-2011, 10:10 AM
If going for a custom build, I would tend to think the 308 cartridge preferable to the 30-06 for this project. And I say that as a confirmed 30-06 fan. It is just that the ballisitics are so close as to be functionally the same for hunting, and 308 is a trifle shorter, lighter, and a bit more available in surplus ammo as well.
I don't know, G1. In a break open gun, you lose the advantage of a shorter action that you get in a bolt or semi-auto, so I don't really see any reason to go with the .308 instead of the slightly more powerful and more flexible .30-06. Its not like anyone is going to be burning through hundreds of rounds in a break open, single shot rifle so the availability of cheap surplus ammo does not seem like a big deal. Likewise, it seems unlikely that you would be carrying more than a half dozen rounds for the rifle in the field, so bulk and weight of the ammo seems unimportant, too. The only reason I could see for going with the .308 instead is if you are already set up for reloading that cartridge and not the .30-06.

Just my 2 :)

hunter63
12-31-2011, 01:42 PM
I don't know, G1. In a break open gun, you lose the advantage of a shorter action that you get in a bolt or semi-auto, so I don't really see any reason to go with the .308 instead of the slightly more powerful and more flexible .30-06. Its not like anyone is going to be burning through hundreds of rounds in a break open, single shot rifle so the availability of cheap surplus ammo does not seem like a big deal. Likewise, it seems unlikely that you would be carrying more than a half dozen rounds for the rifle in the field, so bulk and weight of the ammo seems unimportant, too. The only reason I could see for going with the .308 instead is if you are already set up for reloading that cartridge and not the .30-06.

Just my 2 :)

I agree, surplus ammo is mostly FMJ, not the ideal hunting ammo.
because it is a single shot barrel ammo cost should not be a concern at all, unless you are going to burn thru 100's of rounds.

.308--30-06 are real close in ballistics, so it boils down to personnel preferences, not cost.

41magfan
12-31-2011, 03:40 PM
My "do it all" gun is a Remington 11-87 .12 Gauge. It has a 21" barrel with rifle sights that I've retrofitted with an XS "Express" BIG Dot sight system.

With a variety of screw-in chokes (factory tubes along with a Pattern Master Extended Range) I can shoot slugs accurately to almost 100 yards, throw buckshot and large shot loads to well over 50 yards, and regular birdshot loads for wingshooting. This setup will handle small game, waterfowl, home defense or any big game animal on this continent. Even non-lethal and chemical munitions are an option.

I can defend and fend for myself quite effectively and efficiently with this gun and I have yet to find anything better as a one gun solution.

Moe M.
12-31-2011, 04:47 PM
Personally I like the idea of a combo gun for forraging or survival hunting, IMO multi-barreled single shot guns are not true combo guns, and some require a screwdriver to take the forearm off for changing barrels.
As for caliber, unless one lives in heavy dangerous bear country all one needs is a .22 RF. with a 20ga. shotgun over and under combo, it'll take any North American game safely and surely short of dangerous brown bears.
For that matter a youth model 12 or 20 gage shotgun and a accurate .22RF. handgun would be just as handy.
In my part of the country there isn't much in the way of upland birds, thirty years of building has ruined most upland habitat, and cyotes have accounted for a lot of birds, more likely game is rabbit, squirril, turkey, and the occational deer, my personal choice is either a .22RF Single Six and my .357mag. lever rifle, or a compact .357mag. revolver and a .22RF rifle.
If the time ever comes that I find a model 24 Savage combo gun for a fair price, that will be my new woods roaming gun.

Hawkcreek
12-31-2011, 05:41 PM
I haven't read every post here so it may have already been mentioned but what about something like a T/C Encore (or similar switch barrel firearm). I realize changing barrels wouldn't be as convenient as having "both" in your hand ready to go but it seems an easier option to find and probably cheaper. This would give you a lot more leeway in caliber choices although you seem to have that already figured out. I know the T/C has both smoothbore and rifled 20 and 12 gauge barrels and many different calibers. Just my $.02

Fiddlehead
01-02-2012, 03:47 PM
I would look into a Finnish Valmet combo rifle. Some friends of mine in Maine bought one and I believe it was .308 and 12ga. The price is moderate and the quality better than Savage. They were living off the land and needed the 'right' rifle with them, when game presented itself.

wingnut
01-02-2012, 07:39 PM
i love my m6 scout but i havent used any other combo gun mine is in 22 hornet and 410. i only have an opinion and no facts to compare with. good friend of mine has same rifle and also loves it. for what its worth

clc79092
01-02-2012, 09:40 PM
I love the idea of a combo. Unfortunately the execution just isnt there. I had a remington spr94 22lr/ 410 that consistently misfired in the 410 barrel. I also had a 30-30/ 20 gauge savage that misfired on the 30-30 barrel frequently. Numerous attempts at fixing with different gunsmiths fail to get me dependability out of either weapon.

whiteoak
01-03-2012, 09:29 PM
I haven't read every post here so it may have already been mentioned but what about something like a T/C Encore (or similar switch barrel firearm). I realize changing barrels wouldn't be as convenient as having "both" in your hand ready to go but it seems an easier option to find and probably cheaper. This would give you a lot more leeway in caliber choices although you seem to have that already figured out. I know the T/C has both smoothbore and rifled 20 and 12 gauge barrels and many different calibers. Just my $.02

This would also be my choice, with a 12ga / .22lr / and 30-06 you could do everythiing in the lower 48 with ease. If you need another caliber just add a barrel as you go (one warning however TC barrels cost as much as some others charge for the hole gun) H&R will add a barrel to a gun but it is factory fitted, and you need to send the gun in. I have one of them done in .44mag and .243win.

g8rgar
01-03-2012, 09:59 PM
I have a .22 over a .410 something to think about is that my .22 has about the same bullet drop as a .410 slug at 100yds. Pretty good deer gun.

p moore
01-03-2012, 11:16 PM
I am really warming up to the shotgun as a good combo. A shot barrel, and a rifled barrel for sabot. I have read good results out to 200 yards with a sabot. easly take anything around here.

Paul

Robbvious
01-05-2012, 09:05 PM
Man, am I glad I found this gun. Does dang near everything I need a long gun for:

The Ultimate Woodsman's Gun? - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FnYQw8Lemk)

chinookpilot77
01-05-2012, 09:37 PM
So me and a buddy of mine have both recently come to the realization that we would like one gun to do it all. Tough shoes to fill, but I'm confident that an intelligently selected combo gun can handle it.

Here's my problem. The majority of potential guns I have seen are .22/.410. I have a problem with this because in general terms, I can bag the same game with either. Throw in a .410 slug and I guess I can handle deer, but that's not very versatile.

Call me brainwashed by the green machine, but I do prefer a .30 caliber bullet. I'm confident that on this continent I can handle most large game with a 30-06, so there's my rifle component. Now for the shotgun. I need something that can handle small game such a grouse and hare, but also get me in the game with waterfowl. I'm leaning towards 20 gauge but really, I am undecided.

After many long debates, usually at the pub, I am still undecided. This is going to be a rather expensive purchase for me and I'd like to get it right. What's your opinion? I'm not thinking along the lines of a survival rifle so ammo constraints don't bother me. If you could take one combo gun into the bush with you, what would it be and why?


If I HAD to take a combo it'd be a .22 over 20ga. .22 for obvious reasons, 20ga and not 12ga because you can carry a 1/3 more ammo for the same weight and there isn't anything a 12 can do that a 20 can't.

HOWEVER, I've had a few combos, and I'm not overly impressed with their accuracy. My current set up is whatever my hunting rifle is at the time, and a superlightweight ruger 22/45 pistol in .22lr. It weighs 22oz and gives me .22lr capability in addition to my .308, or whatever else I happen to be hunting with at the time.

go2ndamend
01-05-2012, 09:44 PM
I have been fortunate enough over the past several decades to acquire upwards of a dozen different combo guns. Mostly I have the Savage 24's. .22 LR/20, .22 Mag./20, .357/20 and a 30-30/20. I have a couple of other Combo's also including an M-6 Scout. Having shot, hunted and packed these types of firearms for years, I can say without a doubt that if the chips were down in a true survival situation, I would choose my Remington 870, Ruger 10/22 or Ruger Single Six .22 Revolver over any Combo gun. In my experience, the Combo guns are neither reliable enough, accurate enough or comfortable enough to carry in a true emergency compared to the other firearms I have listed. That being said, I obviously like the Combo gun concept and have used them to great effect bagging all sorts of furred and feathered game over the years. Just my two cents.

Falstaff
01-05-2012, 10:34 PM
Not to high jack and actually on the same theme, does anyone have any thoughts on a drillings (three barrel combo gun, typically a double barrel shotgun with a third rifle caliber barrel underneath)? I understand they are bit rare outside of Europe.

swissarmy67
01-06-2012, 09:16 AM
Robbvious,

Very good video. You generally don't see the actual targets when people talk about these types of guns.

I have printed my Baikal with birdshot and .22lr but no slugs yet.

chinookpilot77
01-06-2012, 11:53 AM
Robbvious,

Very good video. You generally don't see the actual targets when people talk about these types of guns.

I have printed my Baikal with birdshot and .22lr but no slugs yet.


I printed several targets with a 24C I had a while back...I was too embarrassed by them to post them. .22 shot where I wanted it too...the 20ga shot 12" low and to the left...at 25 YARDS!

That thing was sold for a 25 dollar profit. If the thing was within an inch at 25 yards, I'd have kept it though...handy little gun, but I refuse to have something that unpredictable in my safe.

chinookpilot77
01-06-2012, 11:55 AM
Not to high jack and actually on the same theme, does anyone have any thoughts on a drillings (three barrel combo gun, typically a double barrel shotgun with a third rifle caliber barrel underneath)? I understand they are bit rare outside of Europe.



A friend has one. I'll say this...the germans do drillings better than anything made here in the states...but you get what you pay for. They are very heavy and VERY expensive compared to a traditional rifle.

I say pack a good rifle, and carry the best/lightest .22 pistol you can find/afford.

cloudraker
01-06-2012, 01:22 PM
A friend has one. I'll say this...the germans do drillings better than anything made here in the states...but you get what you pay for. They are very heavy and VERY expensive compared to a traditional rifle.

The drillings show up at gun shows in Canada on a regular basis. Most are in 16 gauge for some reason. They are heavy and usuall run 2000.00 used.

I have the Brno in 308/12 gauge. Bought it a looong time ago when I was single and with no significant other to allocate money to renovations or feeding kids. LOL. My favorite woods gun. It is heavy but comfortable to shoot. I've hunted everything with it from muskrat to black bear, grouse to ducks. I had to reload to get the right accuracy from the 308 - it really loves 165gr nosler partitions. Does OK with factory Winchester 150 gr

There is lots of versatility with subcal inserts for this combo, and it can get crazy with the amount of ammo you can carry. Sub cals I have are 32 auto and 410. I usually only carry the 32 auto for grouse and the coup de grace on large game.

Zig
01-06-2012, 01:33 PM
I'd go with 30-30 over 20 ga, but that's tailored to my environment. Up in BC it might be worth it to go for 30-06 over 12 ga. You've got some big critters up there. I also don't have any interest in waterfowl yet.

I don't know what the rules are in Canada, but if you have to use steel shot, 12 ga is the way to go.

BushBum
01-06-2012, 10:28 PM
my 2cents fwiw 1 gun with 2 barrels..
get h&r handi rifle in 30-06, then send the action in and have it fitted with a 12 gauge barrel fitted for screw on chokes..that'll do it all there for half the price of a double gun
in a solid spartan configuration... use the extra cheddar to get a .22 pistol and a collapsible fishing pole and you;ll never go hungry.

Mykos
01-07-2012, 12:42 PM
I don't know what the rules are in Canada, but if you have to use steel shot, 12 ga is the way to go.

Yes, in Canada you have to use non-toxic shot for waterfowl. Lead is fine for upland game birds.

You can buy the Kent tungsten matrix non-tox in 20 gauge at most of the big stores here (wholesale sports etc.).

archer74
01-07-2012, 07:43 PM
For Christmas this year, we got my son a Rossi matched pair that came with a 20ga barrel and a .243 Win barrel. It all breaks down and fits in a small canvas case that it came with. Cost about $280 special ordered from Walmart. Nice single action. They have lots of options for caliber / gauge combinations. We are happy with it. He should be able to hunt just about everything that is legal with one or the other.