Anxiety/ panic attacks

Discussion in 'Bush Medicine' started by survival45, Oct 26, 2016.

  1. survival45

    survival45 Tracker

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    Yes we have done family outings and hikes. unfortunately because it is getting colder they dont wanna be out there. i think i just need to find me a spot thats close by that i can stop after work.
  2. DrHuman

    DrHuman Tracker

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    Kava Kava has always worked wonders for me, but these days I prefer L-theanine when I need a miracle. Both are easily available at any healthfood store. There's been a lot of talk of breathing in this thread too. Lately I've been finding controlling my breathing and relaxing my posture do a good deal to lessen the intensity of reactions.
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  3. YacoltWose

    YacoltWose Supporter Supporter

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    Hey man, you've been on my mind, but I've been seeing family in FL, and haven't been near a real computer, so it's taken me a while to get back to you.

    I'm in a naturalist training program that emphasizes the "Sit spot," which has helped me out a bunch, even if it is just for ten minutes a day.

    Here's a few links about sit spots:

    https://www.wildernessawareness.org/node/261

    Sit Spot

    The 5 Qualities of a Perfect Sit Spot

    That little practice has helped me a bunch, and made me a better woodsman and naturalist too.
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  4. Badey

    Badey Supporter Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I Bushclass II

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    As someone who used to have the worst anxiety I've ever heard of, here's my take:

    Several years ago, I had anxiety so bad, it was difficult to leave the house. I went to the ER on a regular basis with panic attacks, thinking I was dying. I had scary thoughts all the time and thought I would never be able to live a normal life again. I had to significantly cut back my hours at work, my marriage began to suffer, and my family situation became strained.

    Basically my life was in a downward spiral out of control. I couldn't drive anywhere without knowing where the nearest hospital was, and I lived in constant fear of dying. I had a panic attack a day, sometimes several a day. I would be so anxious I would go days without sleeping, which only made my anxiety worse. When I did sleep, I would have anxiety-driven nightmares, or would wake up in the middle of a panic attack.

    Medication didn't help, at all. I was on a benzodiazepine for close to a year with no effect. "Natural" remedies didn't really help either. The meds just treated the symptoms (not all that effectively in my case), and not the root cause(s).

    Counseling also didn't help at all. Talking about my imagined health problems (I had a lot of chest pain, palpitations, skipped heartbeats, etc.), made me more anxious.



    What actually helped me was embracing the anxiety, and what I call "leaning into" it (not fighting it, but meeting it head on).

    This might not be a popular opinion, but, I think that my anxiety was dominating my life largely due to the fact that I felt like a victim of it, instead of learning to push through it.

    Anyway, I had to reach a point in my life where I decided that I was either going to die (from my imagined health problems) or beat anxiety.

    Instead of dreading panic attacks, I decided I was going to just let them come. Once I adopted this attitude, they started coming less and less frequently.

    Then, I decided to start doing things that made me afraid (running, driving more than 15 minutes from a hospital, being alone - especially going on solo hikes, etc).

    I did things to help distract myself (listening to music, engaging in hobbies, etc.).



    Anyway, I'm not saying that it was easy, but as I pushed myself, my symptoms began to significantly decrease. I stopped having panic attacks, and even the anxious/scary thoughts began to go away.

    I haven't been to a hospital for years. I still have days where I feel the pull of anxiety (usually when I haven't gotten much sleep for a few days in a row), but the concept of meeting it head on (not fighting to not have the feelings, but accepting them and daring them to do their worst) keeps it from taking me back down the road where I was.

    Now I live as normal of a life as a human can. I think about "normal" things, and enjoy life instead of dreading the next panic attack, scary thought, etc.



    So, my $.02 is, if you are struggling with anxiety, medication might help the symptoms, but it probably won't help you make any progress toward reclaiming your life (if it does work for you, that's awesome). You're either going to be a "victim" or you're going to be a "victor" (sorry if that is too corny, but it is the wording that came to mind).

    Close to a decade ago, I was the biggest anxiety "victim" my counselors had encountered, but a change in mindset has helped me overcome it.

    Hope this helps someone.
  5. prybry

    prybry Tracker

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    Try counting to 10 out of order... 1, 2, 4, 7, 6, 8, 3, 5, 9, 10
    Or spell your name backwards out loud...
    Worked for my niece when she was younger.
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  6. YacoltWose

    YacoltWose Supporter Supporter

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    Hey man thanks for that.
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  7. okcmco

    okcmco Hobbyist Hobbyist

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    Dude. Very inspiring and not just for anxiety sufferers. I had been trying to lean into uncertainty for most of the year. Embracing change and looking for the good.
    Thanks for your post


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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  8. backlasher

    backlasher Supporter Supporter Bushcraft Friend

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    Thank you for this.
    Thank you for this.
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  9. WildMedGuru

    WildMedGuru Scout

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    Someone earlier mentioned being stuck without their meds in the mountain.
    Personally I recommend ( and personally stick to this regimine for my own needs) always having 72 hours worth of what ever you need medication wise everytime you leave the house.
    Literally EDC the stuff.

    Why
    -Anxiety, Hypertension, Migraines, Diabetes, ETC ..... no sense in risking attacks, withdrawl, etc.... if you can help it at all

    So what if your pushed greater than 72 hours
    -if known, you could at least half dose to get some effect of about anything anyone takes (ration)
    -if day 3 looks good but now your pushed into day 4, well God help ya, and that my friends is called SHTF
    -extended situations may suck, you may have to improvise, but I really do recommend anyone considering the 72 hr philosophy
    -Since this topic was generally about anxiety, and example would be Alprazolam, find some small keychain size pill fob, and just keep 3 more days worth in it (dont forget to rotate meds every 6mo to one year)

    - even for those whom dont wanna EDC more than they have too, thats fine, I'm not talking about motrin or tyelnol, just carrying literally the meds you HAVE to HAVE.
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  10. Hoof

    Hoof Guide

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    Keep in mind that having any prescrition drug that is not in the identified container with your name on it makes you subject to arrest. Even though a judge will dismiss charges after proof of legal possession you will go through arrest, booking, bonding out of jail, an overall bad day. And then your name is in the local paper for a sched (?) drug arrest

    You wouldn't believe how often I have to bond innocent men and women out of jail for this
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  11. WildMedGuru

    WildMedGuru Scout

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    I hear your point. And agree about unlabled containers.
    But in 25 years of medicine, I've never had one paitient with a pill container, nor small baggie or bottle of tylenol, or what ever the hell pill, ever once tell me they were arrested for drugs due to carrying a few "daily meds" regarding the average law biding adult.

    Again not arguing, nor saying its a great idea, but just noting a point.
    If we are getting to the point your patted down and or searched, then I'd be more concerned as to what the hell was that person doing or did.

    And for safety concerns its foolish (despite the legality of unlabled meds) to carry around a full bottle of anything
    - lose or have stolen your Rx narc, benzo, what ever - Your very likely not to get it refilled by anyone regardless of excuse

    - same applies even to something simple as motrin, do you carry a few for aches and pains or all 400 in a huge ass bottle everywhere you go??

    -Airline travel, though, especially out of the country is the one exception - but then i'd only take whats needed in the Rx bottle and leave the rest at home

    -one tip: you could at least snap a photo of the pill bottle with one of the acutal pills beside it of each you take, this isnt by no means a subsitutute for a correctly labled bottle, but its better than nothing

    ...just food for thought.
  12. basher1981

    basher1981 Supporter Supporter

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    Well I covered a major milestone today. I had sinus surgery and was awake for it with little to no anxiety. I did breathing techniques and focusing on objects and just asking questions to the docs. I was on Percocet for pain and numb up quite good but seeing needles come at your face is still some scary stuff. This is big for me bc a lot of my
    Anxiety stems around health issues that's aren't really there
  13. Badey

    Badey Supporter Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I Bushclass II

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    That's great! Keep celebrating each victory!
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  14. basher1981

    basher1981 Supporter Supporter

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    Thanks man! Small steps equaled a big one for me today.
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  15. LMT66

    LMT66 Supporter Supporter

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    Progressive muscle relaxation will help along with proper breathing. You can do it without anyone noticing.

    Take some time to write everything down that's swirling around in your mind. Weed out the things that really have nothing to do with what your actually anxious or worried about. Its easy to "pile on" when its not on paper. Give yourself a half hour to an hour everyday to think about whats left on the list. Can you solve it in your allotted time? If not, set it aside for the next days worry time.

    It's important to try and figure out why your having anxiety and panic attacks. Might seem hard but you can figure it out by yourself or by talking to someone. Overwhelmed with family life? Social phobia? Uncertain about the future?

    Exercise, exercise, exercise! Walking each day can do wonders. Go to bed and get up around the same time every day. Don't cut yourself short of sleep.

    Panic attack's wont kill you but they sure can wreak havoc on you. I use a Ativan when needed for sudden anxiety and to help me sleep when I have trouble doing so. A small dose (0.5 mg pill) does wonders quickly if natural techniques fail me.

    Every year I go on vacation up by Lake Superior. I always dayhike back to an old mine site that is way off in the woods. It has the remnants of an apple orchard and bears frequent the area in fall. I always get anxiety going back there. That is true anxiety to me so I try and remember it well and remind myself of that when I'm back in the rat race and having anxiety. Its good to experience the real deal to put things in perspective.
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  16. Flint_2016

    Flint_2016 Guide

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    Our thinking does regulate our depression and anxiety,i.e.negative self talk versus positive self talk,but also there are many of us out there who have chemical imbalances that require medications like benzos,Seroquel,mood stabilizers,SSRI's like Prozac and Citalopram.I have first hand knowledge of this,being medicated by a physician since 1994.It's a combo of the meds.,therapy,the proper thinking,lifestyle,and exercise.With me getting out in the bush and camping/hiking/practicing skills that raised my confidence level and gets me "out of myself" as well.Bushcraft/outdoors is great therapy,the best ever.The shortening of days produce some depression known as Seasonal Affect Disorder but I have learned for the most part to overcome that as well.The worst though which has been difficult to adjust to is our financial situation that has caused anxiety.I try and tell myself that this too shall pass.Acceptance is the key, plus family and friends,charities,food banks,government subsidies,etc.that have helped us through it,not to forget my higher power.
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  17. Flint_2016

    Flint_2016 Guide

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    See your physician.You may have a chemical imbalance that only he/she will know how/what to treat you.SSRI's like Paxil,Prozac,Depakote,are non benzos.I can't take Benzos,I am allergic to them,being prescribed to Seroquel and Depakote.Shrubby Saint Johnswort would come under bush medicine,but I'd still see a doctor if I were you.I have first hand knowledge of such a situation,and it's all too common.Bushcraft is a great therapy for me,getting out in the woods and camping,hiking,practicing skills will boost your self confidence.
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  18. MountainMan706

    MountainMan706 Supporter Supporter Bushcraft Friend

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    I don't know if the OP is still around but this may help. It's not an herbal remedy but it helps. It is a specific meditation video/audio. It sounds like a diesel engine running (It is not a recording of an actual diesel engine). When I am calm I rarely listen to it but when I am agitated the mild thumping/humming calms me down very quickly. Meditation video.

    I listen to different videos. But to calm down quickly this is definitely the most effective.
  19. Harper

    Harper Guide

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    -

    I would argue that, while there can be chemical imbalances, it is not the result of your body not making/getting enough of (or over producing):
    Your body doesn't make that stuff or naturally get it from its envirornment. I would further argue that--at least in many cases-- it is a lack of proper nutrition/lifestyle (I include good air, exercise, etc. in that) and the results of stress/state of mind (as you suggest). Nutrition/lifestyle is how your body was designed to naturally get the (beneficial) components of those drugs you mention.

    Stress/mind state certainly produce/affect chemical reactions in the body. That is why mindfulness training is so important. And for many, prayer, too. They are different.

    I have never had an issue with this stuff, but I know others who have. Good nutrition, exercise and mindfulness have helped them get off their meds and improved the quality of their lives (and their families') demonstrably. They were sleepwalking through life on their meds. It pained me just to see it.

    If people need help, by all means they should get it. Work with the doctor. But try to get (or switch to) one that knows about holistic modalties and tell him you'd like to try them first (if at all possible). Medications do have value and a place--last place, in my opinion. But sometimes they are necessary. Understand, however, that they all have side effects whether you see them or not. If you can figure out how those chemical imbalances came to be and then naturally correct them, then you are way way ahead of the game. It's probably cheaper, too.

    I know that there are others here who will disagree.

    A word of caution: if people are currently taking meds and then find that some of these holistic methods help, DON'T cut your meds by yourself--it could be dangerous. Work with your doctor.


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  20. Flint_2016

    Flint_2016 Guide

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    I won't dispute this but I to disagree with you.But we can agree to disagree.No biggie
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  21. Flint_2016

    Flint_2016 Guide

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    Not being a professional myself in medicine(I'm a pro at telling funny stories)I go by what I've heard.My having first hand knowledge with being in therapy,and taking necessary meds for bi-polar disorder.But that hasn't stopped me from enjoying life or working.Yes poor diet/malnourishment adversely affects health in general and exacerbate depression.Cut refined sugars out of your diet as much as possible. Depression is often linked to low serotonin levels in the brain, and sugars give a temporary boost to serotonin. It's no wonder that many people crave sugar when depressed! But the boost is only temporary and you will crash later. Don't be tempted by sugary foods.IExercise regularly. Exercise gives you a natural high and adrenaline rush, which can boost your mood for hours at a time. Try to exercise on a regular basis.I found this info to help clear things up for me or anyone else reading it.Got quite off track here perhaps.I say so much for Bush Medicine LOL.I'm sticking to applying first aid to somebody.

    "Most people misunderstand the meaning of "chemical imbalances" in the brain. This phrase has become the buzzword to use today to explain mental health problems, including social anxiety. Chemical imbalances exist because the neural pathway systems of the brain sometimes lead to emotional pain (i.e., anxiety) and irrational conclusions."
    Why you develop social anxiety has more to do with environment than it has to do with genetics. However, there are always interactive combinations occurring.

    People do not generally understand that even if something is genetically influenced, this does not mean it is genetically caused. Social anxiety can not occur unless events, situations, and circumstances in the persons' environment "push" or "lead" the person to develop it.

    Because we develop social anxiety over time (although some people feel it hits them all at once), the brain is learning how to be socially anxious -- this is cognitive structuring. The brain learns how and what to be afraid of. If you're afraid of a certain event, and this event triggers your anxiety, then the neurons in your brain fire together, and over time, they wire together. "
    Social Anxiety, Chemical Imbalances, and Neural Pathways in the Brain | Social Anxiety Institute
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  22. survival45

    survival45 Tracker

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    Wow thats an amazing story thank you for sharing! i know exactly what you mean by those scary thoughts or the feeling as though you are dying. I have been to the hospital a few times because of panic attacks thinking i was having a heart attack. it seems as though everything you have talked about i have felt as well. And i totally understand that feeling of know where a hospital is at all times. i couldnt go anywhere unless i knew ahead of time and all of the hospitals along the route.

    On a good note to report to everyone: I have sleep apnea and have been sleeping without my mask for almost a year. on top of the anxiety and panic attacks that i was having. I decided enough was enough with feeling tired constantly so i started wearing my bipap machine while sleeping again. And i am glad to report that not only has my sleep got better, but my anxiety and panic attacks have minimized alot! I feel as though i have regained alot of my life back. although i still do have them its easier to deal with and not as bad. I still need to find some me time to get out in the woods and calm my nerves, but i am getting alot better. Thank you again to everyone for putting in your advice and stories!
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  23. FreudianSlip

    FreudianSlip Scout

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    Flint I enjoyed reading your posts and bringing about the age old debate of nature vs nurture as well as your openness regarding personal experience. In regards of nature vs nurture - it depends case to case. You make a good point that what truly matters is working towards making the changes we can make to promote decreases in anxiety to a functioning level (note some anxiety is helpful and needed). Even if we can change just 1% of what we do to get the most out of life that's the 1% we focus on.
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  24. Rifleman336

    Rifleman336 Tracker

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    I know for a fact Doctors prescribe vistaril a variant of Benadryl. A friend of mine takes two 25 Mg Benadryl tablets, for saving money over prescribed vistaril. It seems to work.
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  25. hayshaker

    hayshaker Scout

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    cut back on coffee,booze smokes all these increse anxiety
    do exersise, jog, keep busy, vitamin b-complex C,st jhons wort, valerian root,
    do breathing exercises,
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  26. caoutdoorsman

    caoutdoorsman Scout

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    I'm not a doctor and don't have any experience with this so I can't really give advice, but know that we support you!
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  27. Swarvegorilla

    Swarvegorilla Scout

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    Not really the same thing, but having been spooked late at night by something moving through bushes around my camp.... I find stoking up the fire and making a spear to have a calming effect :) Theres also some evidence to suggest that the use of lavender oil in WWI hospitals had a calming effect on those with shellshock, but smelling like lavender is unlikely going to be high on anyones bucket list.
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  28. HP500

    HP500 Tracker

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    I can definitely relate
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  29. haunted

    haunted Scout

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    well they keep telling me tai chi or meditation works
  30. Subdood

    Subdood Ex-bubblehead Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    Not at all making light, I have had some panic attacks myself. All after I got out of the Submarie business (go figure) and, nowhere near the magnitude you stated. For me it is big cities that I am not familiar with. Not super good for a guy that spends a lot of time on the road. What you describe is what I have heard called "embracing the suck" and it does work.

    Thanks for sharing that stuff with us. THAT takes guts Bro!

    And to the OP, prayers sent.
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  31. Subdood

    Subdood Ex-bubblehead Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    "-Airline travel, though, especially out of the country is the one exception - but then i'd only take whats needed in the Rx bottle and leave the rest at home"

    If I may add a bit to this as a frequent International Traveller, I would make two suggestions. Get scripts from your Dr prior to leaving and for generics if possible. And research the requirements for the Countrie(s) you will be visiting in adavance if at all possible. Not all drugs that are legally prescribed in the US are legal elsewhere. Particularly narcotics and the classes of drugs used to treat these types of maladies.

    As an exampleIn some countries (Japan for one) requires prior permission from their consulate to bring certain types of drugs (legally prescribed of course) into the Country at all.

    Hope this helps
  32. snuffy72

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    Effective treatment for Ptsd or general anxiety can go many ways. Everyone has a different trigger. Finding that trigger can be a great step towards helping yourself. As someone that deals with ptsd I know how aggravating it can be. Xanax and other prescribed drugs can be useful in adjusting to the issue a hand, while learning techniques to control it. Eventually the sufferer must find his triggers and happy places. And drugs will become less necessary, used for emergency issues only. Good luck to all who suffer and have faith in yourselves
  33. KIVALO

    KIVALO Scout

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    I find this to be great advise. I have always thought of it as "frame of reference" but a rose is but a rose so to speak. Either way that shift in attitude made me considerably better better equipped to deal with these sorts of things.
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  34. MountainMan706

    MountainMan706 Supporter Supporter Bushcraft Friend

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    how much can we talk about this here?
    one needs to be very careful not to stay on them too long
    many people become very dependent.....
    I didn't, but have seen friends who did
    I tired benzos, they help a lot, but you have to be careful
    I took them only a very short time...
  35. snuffy72

    snuffy72 Tracker

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    Not sure how much we can talk about it, just flap people can talk.
  36. snuffy72

    snuffy72 Tracker

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    A lot of what you take is on the doctors and how you handed yourself
  37. snuffy72

    snuffy72 Tracker

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    If you are curious we can talk.
  38. MountainMan706

    MountainMan706 Supporter Supporter Bushcraft Friend

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    no i meant how much talk about meds is allowed here?
    everone has a diff opinon on how much or how little meds to take
    i dont take much but i do take a few and those few i take on a "permanet" basis
    right now it is depakote
    which for me is even better than the lithium
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  39. russw25

    russw25 Scout

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    Thank you for the information in here guys, While I am not the OP either this has been a great read. Thanks everyone
  40. GoodOlBoy

    GoodOlBoy Scout

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    I have PTSD presenting with Hyper-Vigilance, Depression, and Anxiety. Panic attacks, and Serotonin storms are the norm for me. I still have to take meds, alot of them, and they still don't do much if anything.

    I just wanted to say thanks so much for a good and interesting read. I've been trying to get a handle on this for years with no luck.

    Thank you all.

    God Bless, and One Love.

    GoodOlBoy
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  41. FreudianSlip

    FreudianSlip Scout

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    May want to consult with your physician regarding effectiveness of your medications. Counseling can be an effective tool to aid in recovery, there are many proven techniques to assist people with PTSD. Counseling plus medications typically has the best outcomes.
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  42. GoodOlBoy

    GoodOlBoy Scout

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    We've talked about it. At one point in time the previous physician had me on roughly three times the maximum dosage of Effexor per day, plus about two dozen other meds (Lexapro, Lorazapam, Prozac, etc all at once 37+ total pills a day at that point not counting emergency meds). I was quite literally a walking zombie with blown out iris's, and was STILL having the anxiety and panic attacks.

    God Bless, and One Love.

    GoodOlBoy
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  43. FreudianSlip

    FreudianSlip Scout

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    I can see why you wouldn't be too thrilled by the idea, although you did not mention experiences related to counseling. A walking zombie would definitely create a new problem instead of helping.
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  44. GoodOlBoy

    GoodOlBoy Scout

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    I had excellent experiences with a single counselor. Honestly he got me to where I am now, which is actually an improvement but far from "good". Unfortunately he moved to west Texas to become partner in a children's counseling center. I can certainly understand that but 15 hours one way is a bit much to drive to go to a one hour session twice a week.

    The next half a dozen+ counselors were either complete wack-a-moles or just didn't care about anything except payment via insurance (which I don't have since I've been out of work several years). Seriously counseling in my area is a understaffed en-devour. Once you take the one good one out, his partner out who retired, and the three who have lost their license to practice.... Add in two under investigation by medicare and social security, and well... you got what I've got... nothin'. One nut job with an office full of "therapy cats" is about it within a forty five minute drive. I'm allergic to cats.

    And it's too cold to fish, weed ain't legal in Texas, I don't smoke, and I don't drink except on new years and maybe my birthday...

    God Bless, and One Love. Merry Christmas everybody!

    GoodOlBoy
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  45. MichelVH

    MichelVH Tracker

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    Making tea from catnip works really well, if you let it soak for a long while you'll even get light hallucinations.
  46. FreudianSlip

    FreudianSlip Scout

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    Within the counseling field a new thing that has become more popular is 'tele-mental health.' There are counselors that see people via video chat (not skype, but something much more protected). This helps with increasing access to services. Sounds like that guy was really great, it's a shame he moved. you know I actually met a person who had a therapy cat that was paid for by the VA, I thought that was really neat.

    Edit: oh yeah as far as insurance goes, at least in my state, the state will pay for the services at community counseling centers.
  47. Woods Walker

    Woods Walker Supporter Supporter Bushclass I

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    I wonder if there is a medical condition for being load and obnoxious. Like the opposite of a panic attack cuz I got it.
  48. Leshy

    Leshy Scout

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    Man , I feel for you. I really do , and I hope you don't mind me saying that openly or find me condescending or patronising. It's not meant like that at all.

    It takes a lot of guts for someone on your position to share this in an open forum like this.
    It shows great courage from your part and it's also a reflection of the great community spirit prevalent here on BCUSA.

    Your condition is so complex and severe that I can't even fathom what your coping mechanisms are.

    I wish I had more information to help you with , and by the sounds of it ,the meds are not really helping that much either , other than numbing the symptoms.
    May I ask you how long this has been going on? and what started it in the first place? (PM me if you so wish)

    In my previous posts, I named a few natural herbs and coping strategies that may help with anxiety .
    Depression and PTSD are however quite different and thus different treatments would be recommended.
    From my direct experience with severe depression and bipolar disorder, I found that regular outdoor activities help tremendously.
    Any type of outdoor activity and or sport. Even just walking has a great effect on your mood and disposition.

    As does interaction with horses.

    Horses are great therapists , their majestic beauty and calm inducing nature , makes them great companions and great friends.
    In my experience ,you can just talk to them (some people like that they don't talk back) ,you can groom them , feed them , just hang out with them or even ride them out on your own or with an experienced rider if so required.
    I recommend you do this with no saddle (if possible) , as it really connects you with the animal and with the Earth itself .
    it's a grounding and profoundly rewarding experience.

    My partner has suffered from type 2 bipolar disorder for years and has only now managed to get it relatively under control.
    For years , her doctors kept changing medication and seeking different treatments but the condition persisted.

    As a result she sought out to reconnect with her childhood passion , got back working with horses , and it has helped a lot.
    A lady friend of ours is a qualified horse behaviourist and LEAP practitioner , and helps trauma affected patients as well as disabled children and adults with mental or physical difficulties.
    Also people , with addictions and substance misuse, abuse victims and children from broken homes or disadvantaged backgrounds.

    The time spent with my partner and the horses has been so effective and so rewarding that my partner now works with this lady , helping others .
    And that helps her even more, as it's giving back the help she received.
    It's a cycle of health and love that literally grows right in front of you.
    The thing is, the horse really is the therapist here, and that is the essence of the work.
    Equine therapy is quickly becoming recognised and valued as a very effective tool in treating people with PTSD , depression, and all of the possible scenarios mentioned above.
    I can't recommend it enough, if you have the opportunity to engage with horses , do it ! Maybe a friend of yours has horses or a friend of a friend?
    It is like magic , I promise you.

    Also,
    @Harper has a sound knowledge of the Hedgerow medicine available in the USA ,and he has posted very good advice time and time again...
    ... all these complimentary treatments are worth a shot.

    Please don't stop your meds abruptly or unsupervised even if you find that these natural alternatives are indeed helping you, you should seek professional advice first .
    but by all means aim to reduce the quantities of prescribed meds, if at all possible , when you finally do see fit as it will help your confidence in your own abilities to manage this condition.

    I sincerely hope that things change for you and that you don't give up on finding a helpful and/or competent counselor , as it really does help getting things off your chest .

    Keep positive! As daft and as absurd as it sounds, don't think for a minute your condition will not improve.
    It WILL! It may take time and great effort , but it will improve!

    May 2017 be a great year for you and for your health.

    I sincerely hope things improve for you.

    Kind regards
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  49. JC1

    JC1 Guide

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    Look into DoTerra oils, they are all natural and you can get different oils for different ailments. I've been using them for about two months and notice a big difference.

    I've never heard a scientific study about dirt treatment but it does have a calming affect for me. Go out back and grab a handful of fresh soil from the woods and stick your nose in it, see what happens...
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  50. GoodOlBoy

    GoodOlBoy Scout

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    I appreciate it. I have to be honest about my situation because in the beginning I tried to hide it. I tried to keep people from knowing what was going on, and instead of making life better for me or for anybody else it only made things worse. I'm not a vet. I'm not a hero, and I'm not posting any of this because I want attention or handouts. I saw so much good information posted in this thread that I had no choice but to share. Why? Because I do need advice, I do need honesty. Even brutal honesty. And if that honesty and advice doesn't help me, maybe it will help somebody else. I know what all of this together feels like, and to even inadvertently help a brother or sister who walks this world to alleviate even a single minute of this from themselves is as much of a blessing as I can hope for.

    Today (yesterday on Christmas actually but my days run together) I joined my closest family at my Grandmothers for Christmas. Nine people who love each other, and miss those who couldn't be with us, or just aren't with us anymore. In a room full of loving, laughing, joyful people I lasted about five hours with meds, and emergency meds. Five hours. Then I had to leave. People I want to, and need to spend time with and I had to leave, walk home, and collapse. I slept for twelve hours straight with nightmares that most wouldn't be able to handle. I still FEEL BLESSED. Why? Because last year I lasted four hours. For years before that I couldn't even last a full hour. The longer I walk the earth the more I believe in many of the old ways of doing things. That includes healing. I didn't get here overnight. I won't heal overnight, and in truth probably won't ever completely heal. But this is my journey. Not my end. Not my beginning. Just my journey.

    If you have problems, and it doesn't matter if your problems are worse than mine or better, this isn't a contest. But if you have problems. Seek help. Try it just in case it DOES work for you. Take the advice that has been offered above. Try it just in case it DOES work for you. Talk to a counselor, a bartender, a friend, a random guy on a creek bank where you fish. But whatever you do always remember what I said that this is just your journey. It's not the end, it's not the beginning. It's your journey. Just keep going. Some moments are better. Some are worse. Learn to love yourself and your journey no matter what it holds. Because it is yours. We all struggle with it in some form or fashion. And no, nobody but you can understand all you are going through but you. But many of us can understand the same parts we have been through, and what may not work today, may work tomorrow. As you heal, as you journey forward your needs may change. If they do then walk that path until you cross the next one in your journey.

    Merry Christmas, Happy New Year, God Bless, and One Love!

    Richard

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