Bicycle Riders?

Discussion in 'Transportation' started by werewolf won, Jun 16, 2011.

  1. TraditionalbyChoice

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    Yeah I'm having the same problem. I'm going to replace the grease with a lithium grease to see if that fixes it, or at least helps it.
     
  2. Birdman

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    I like bikes.
    IMG_20150412_171109.jpg
     
  3. GeoKrpan

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    $100 ain't what it used to be.

    I just had a discussion about the cost of bike shit, it's changed so much since I started cycling 30 years ago. Cycling is more popular now and it has become more acceptable socially. People with money to burn are cycling. The manufacturers are accommodating them. A $2000 set of wheels is a lot better than a $200 set of wheels, right? A little better, perhaps, but not 10 times better. And, those $2000 wheels only cost a tiny bit more to manufacture. It's what the market will bear rather than a fair profit. I'm thankful that affordable bike shit still exists. It might not always be that way.

     
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  4. TraditionalbyChoice

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    I'll let you know somthing, that sworks stump jumper my dad got has a set of carbon roval sl wheels with a $1900 msrp. They are just as light as a set of $500 stans 29er aluminum rims. The only benifit is the strength and rigidity.

    Cycling gear is expensive. Most bikes now that are produced are more expensive than a dirt bike. A dirt bike has a lot more engineering in it than a bicycle, yet you still see bikes that have a retail of 8k +. They really don't have to markup items (especially carbon) as much as they do. Most carbon manufacturers are located in asia, and their production costs for a frame may be $20, yet they sell it to you at $2000. A 100% markup? No thanks. I'll stick to getting slightly used components now (except drivetrain).
     
  5. TraditionalbyChoice

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    What hardtail is that ? I haven't seen any hardtail capable of handling a dual crown fork without damaging the frame. I've seen a lot of hard tails with cracked frames because of those forks.
     
  6. Birdman

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    A frame I built myself. I called it the Joker bike. I raced it for a couple seasons, then sold it to a buddy about 5 years ago. It's still holding up. Hope brakes, white Bros 200mm fork, Profile cranks, Mavics laced to King hubs. Just over built in every way haha. Wish I still had it. Very fun bike.
    IMG_20170109_190519_540.jpg
     
  7. GeoKrpan

    GeoKrpan Guide

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    $2000 is a 1000% markup! Ridiculous. Thank God for Bikesdirect.

    The price of bicycles compared to motorcycles is very revealing.

    Canyon Bikes are coming to the US this year from Germany. Internet sales like BD. Great value like BD.

    Carbon road bike with hydraulic discs, 1999 Euros.

    Canyon | ENDURACE | Endurace CF SL Disc 8.0

    [​IMG]

     
  8. GeoKrpan

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  9. GeoKrpan

    GeoKrpan Guide

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  10. GeoKrpan

    GeoKrpan Guide

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  11. GeoKrpan

    GeoKrpan Guide

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    You have some skills to build a frame like that.

     
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  12. Birdman

    Birdman Guide

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    Thanks man. I've wanted to start building frames professionally, but haven't taken the plunge. Maybe some day.
    Here's a fixed gear I did as well. It's now living life as a single speed cyclocross bike.
    IMG_20130310_173259.jpg
     
  13. TraditionalbyChoice

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    That's looks great! I've got a mig welder, I've always wanted to make myself a frame. What's was your first step when you took the plunge to build frames?

    I had $15 off at backcountry, so I have a 11 speed shimano slx cassette, slx derailleur,slx shifter and slx chain on the way. Very reasonably priced for what I got, $145.05 is a great price for a 11 speed drivetrain. I've spent more on a single xo derailleur before. The cassette I went with a 11-42. With my 1x chaining up front I should have a nice granny gear for steep climbs and riding in the snow with the 42t gear.
     
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  14. GeoKrpan

    GeoKrpan Guide

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    $145 is a great price. SLX is great stuff, no need to spend more. ChainReaction and Merlin, both in the UK, have great prices, ships as fast as ordering from the US.
     
  15. TraditionalbyChoice

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    Wasn't really a fan of older Shimano drivetrains, but the new ones peaked my interest. Now I just have to find my chain whip.
     
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  16. TraditionalbyChoice

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    Got picked up from school early. Got a ride in when the weather is nice. Shorts and a 3/4 sleeve jersey. Dad got out on his new bike. I rode it a little bit, and it handles really good!
    Ignore the purple pedals, he forgot the clip less at home and it's what was in the car.

    Me:
    [​IMG]

    My dad:
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  17. Birdman

    Birdman Guide

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    I've been a fabricator and machinist most of my life, and was frustrated finding frames I liked(steel) and when I did, the atrocious prices. So I started building. My first couple were fillet brazed, then tigged. I like a brazed frame better, but far more time consuming. With a good flat table, some v-blocks, torch set, and hacksaw, and some files, you could build a frame. Don't try to mig. The tubing is far too thin.
     
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  18. plumberoy

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    Up graded my mountain bike I don't ride anyplace that calls for a mountain bike A gravel grinder for non paved but maintained trails would do me more good so I started with this
    [​IMG]

    Changed:
    Serfas Drifter 26 x 2 tires
    factory Handle bars off my Surly Steamroller
    Vintage shimano bar end shifters
    new cables,
    Topeak rack from my Long Haul trucker.
    (I put a different topeak rack on trucker)
    I only road it a mile 36 degrees and rain:31:
    But it is a different bike. Gives me 2 geared bikes and 2 single speeds for the local M.U.P. trails
    Another reason for upgrading To keep myself from going over board I limit my self to 5 keeper bikes

    [​IMG]
     
  19. 2jka

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    So this is kinda like biking:
    I've just spent the day at an XC Ski trail center: Craftsbury.Nordic Center Home » Nordic Center » Skiing Page » Craftsbury Outdoor Center
    It was a load of fun. Very challenging, especially those descents! I have a newfound respect to high level XC skiers and the alpine skiers of old, when skies didn't have metal edges. I'm going back out tomorrow. Full report due later as I am away from my computer. It was lots of fun.


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  20. plumberoy

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    Tires made this a whole different bike I rode 5 miles today on it . It is like I got a whole new bike still need to make some adjustments . I am still recovering from an illness that put me in the hospital for 5 days in late Nov. combined with 37 degrees and drizzle 5.1 miles was all I wanted. I am still getting used to the bar end shifters but over all I am happy with my changes
     
  21. 2jka

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    Yeah a chance of tires can really be night and day on a bike. Even smallish differences like going from 2.2 to 2.3 can just be night and day.


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  22. plumberoy

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    I changed from Kendra 26 x 1.95 mountain bike tires to 26 x 2 Serfas drifter urban tires plus I think the narrower bars help
     
  23. TraditionalbyChoice

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    Slx 11 speed drive train installed

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  24. plumberoy

    plumberoy Guide

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    Just got back from doing 8.2 miles slowly getting back to full strength I have my rebuilt bike to the point that I can just carry the normal on bike tools and not a handful of extra tools for adjustments It is still gears like a mountain bike so it isn't going to be a speedster but for bumming maintained paths and down along the river it will fill a niche
    Roy
     
  25. GeoKrpan

    GeoKrpan Guide

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    I have the same rear derailleur on my touring bike, work of art. The rest of the drivetrain is Deore and it ain't shabby either. The Deore crank is 48/36/26, perfect for the mission. The Deore front shifter has a switch on it to select double or triple chainrings.

     
  26. TraditionalbyChoice

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    I really like it so far! I like the Shimano 11 speed drive trains a lot better than the sram. The sram you need a new free hub if you plan on running srams 11 speed cassette. That was the deal breaker for me. Shimano's 11 speed cassette was made for a 10 speed freehub, which my fat bike has.

    Eventually sometime layer this year these parts will be going on a carbon fat bike frame, and carbon wheels may be sometime down the road also. I'd get the wheels from the company I got my Chinese fork from. That's as long as I can make enough $$ this spring and early summer, I'll be at RIT in mid august.
     
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  27. GeoKrpan

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    I was thinking of a carbon fork for my 29+ but I'm not sure, from my research, that it would be better than the steel fork that I have. I'd hate to spend the money and time for no reason. I'm thinking it would probably be better to spend the money on some high end tires.
     
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  28. Blackhills

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    I'll be the first guy to say that bikes in general are overpriced and carbon in particular has crazy prices, but no one is making a frame with production costs of $20. From everything I've read, including stuff from people who actually make frames one at a time, the low end is probably more like $2-300.
     
  29. Blackhills

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    Glad to hear you're back on the bike.

    I would suggest changing out the stem as well. That length might have been fine with the flat bars but with drop bars your hands are now further away for the most part. Kalloy makes a pretty inexpensive "dirt drop" stem that's easy to find on eBay.....it's what I used when I converted my old MTB to drop bars. As a general rule, you want to set up a drop bar MTB so that the drops are the primary riding position so that means a shorter and taller stem.

    [​IMG]
     
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  30. Blackhills

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    That must only be true for their MTB hubs (which I know nothing about) but it's not the case for the Shimano road hubs. I don't run Shimano but I've read enough people complaining about having to buy new wheels/hubs to go to 11sp to know that an 11sp cassette won't fit on a 10sp freehub - though I think a couple of aftermarket companies make a conversion cassette which will work on the 10sp hub.

    FWIW, I run Campy, where a 9sp, 10sp and 11sp freehub are all the same size.
     
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  31. TraditionalbyChoice

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    I was speaking metaphorically, but I see what your talking about. I know though that the production costs for some of these carbon frames are under $100, especially these Chinese ones. Most company's **cough cough Santa Cruz ** use frames that are made over in china. I guess what I'm trying to say is low production price, very high sale price.
     
  32. TraditionalbyChoice

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    Yep, mtb hubs and road bike hubs are different in that aspect. 10 speed free hubs for mtb's can fit Shimano 11 speed cassettes, but cannot fit sram 11 speed cassettes, those require a xd driver.
     
  33. whiskeyjack

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    I don't understand why anyone would spend the money upgrading from 10 to 11 speed anyway. Disposable income I guess.
    There's always been way too much focus on gear with cyclists.Just ride what you have, ride it a lot, and replace it when it wears out. But , that's just my opinion, and not much of a consumer.



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  34. 2jka

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    As far as I understand most carbon frames are made in the PRC (China) I'm pretty sure Trek's facilities are Chinese. That might just be where the technology is, and about the dirt bike comparison. Bicycles have a much faster turn around times and a larger variety of products than most dirt bike companies and when they are only selling thousands of one product vs the millions of most of those cheaper dirt bikes so the economy of scales comes into play. Also the degree of tuning required to get a bike just to ride ok (i.e. Efficiently and quickly) is very high. When a .408 HP~300watt person on a bike has the potential to outstrip a 10 hp scooter, the level of efficiency is really put into perspective. All that R&D for each new frame takes time and money, all the new tooling for each new frame cost time and money, and all of that is spread across fewer units sold. Just because of this, it would be no wonder that bikes cost relatively more than a dirt bike does, even with the same level of engineering.

    But, that isn't even the true reason bikes, here in the US, cost so much. No, the reason is that they are, for most, luxury items. If a greater sector of the US use bikes primarily for transportation, then you you can expect more higher value bikes on the market. Until then, most are willing to pay through the nose for a bike so price will remain high. Otherwise Bikes Direct! Vote with your dollars. Other companies cannot afford not to listen to your votes.


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  35. Todd1hd

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    +1 On the research and development cost. It's not the cost of the material and labor only it's the complete invetsment in a correct frame vs. the total volume sold.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2017
  36. TraditionalbyChoice

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    I went from a 2x up front to a 1x, which limited my ratio with my 9 speed rear cassette. To get the ratio back I went to a 11 speed. Not to mention with a fatbike, that 42t granny gear is very handy! I went from a 9 speed to a 11 speed. If I had a 10 speed I wouldn't have seen much of a reason to upgrade, as a one up components 42t cog would have solved the ratio issue. Another benifit of the 11 speed for me is the clutched derailleur for my 1x, where my 9 speed derailleur didn't have a clutch. The clutch helps a lot with chainslap and prevents the chain from dropping.

    I completely forgot to factor r & d into the picture. That mixed with the relatively low sales (these carbon bikes don't sell in the numbers that aluminum do) I could see why they charge such high prices.
     
  37. Blackhills

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    Yes, nearly all the carbon frames are made in China or Taiwan. Some of Trek's higher end frames are still made in the US, but as for Specialized, Cannondale, etc. they're all made in the Far East. The Taiwanese company Merida owns 49% of Specialized and is one of the largest bike companies in the world yet most Americans have never heard of them since they don't sell bikes under their name in the US.

    From - inrng : who made your bike
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2017
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  38. Blackhills

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    I agree with you, though TraditionalByChoice gave a good reason why he did change. I have one bike which is 11sp, I purchased it used and it came that way, but I don't find it to be any improvement over the other bikes I own which are 10sp.

    That 'focus on gear' isn't just with the cyclists themselves, the bike companies/magazines constantly bombard riders with 'new and improved' frames and components. The companies have to keep making new items and selling them to stay in business. If even half of the marketing fluff I've read over the years was true, I could go for a 100 mile ride during which I'd expend no energy and would finish before I started - every year the new models are "faster" and "more efficient".
     
  39. TraditionalbyChoice

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    2jka, have the problems with your dropper and cold weather improved? I rebuilt mine with some lithium grease and it seems to be working fine.
     
  40. GeoKrpan

    GeoKrpan Guide

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    Here's a vid on the problems with 1x.

    If you have 1x, run what you brung, enjoy it, don't even think about it. But, my advice to those buying a bike, don't get 1x.

    I wouldn't "upgrade" a 2x or 3x to 1x, however I might upgrade a 1x to 2 or 3x. The disadvantages of 1x outweigh the advantages of the weight reduction. OTOH, the advantages of 2 or 3x outweigh the disadvantage of the added weight. I'm thinking of upgrading my 29+ from 2x10 to 3x10. It would make it a better bike, lower low gear and higher high gear, less gaps between gears than an 11 or 12 speed cassette, no drag from the clutch mechanism of 1x rear derailleurs. I have a rear derailleur with the clutch mech. It can be switched on and off. There is noticeably more drag when switched on.

     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2017
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  41. TraditionalbyChoice

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    I havent noticed any extra drag with the clutch on, but I guess it would make since because of the constant tension on the chain.. For me the 2x didnt make any since since I hardly used the small gear and the front derailleur gave out after a few hundred miles. I decided that I would not bother with it anymore, I like the simplicity of no front derailleur, It removes clutter from the bars.

    I rode a trail today after a few inches of rain yesterday. It felt like mud bogging. The roots and rocks were beyond wet, so no pictures of rollers today. I did do this wood ladder which ended up being pretty dry. The picture isnt the best quality because it is a screenshot from a video, and I forgot to bring a decent camera. Gopro batteries were dead, I planned on making a small video today.
    trumbull old mine park ladder bridge.jpg
     
  42. GeoKrpan

    GeoKrpan Guide

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    You have some great places to ride. It's actually a pretty good pic for what it is, a screenshot.

    Next time you have your bike in the repair stand, switch the clutch off and I think you'll see what I mean.
     
  43. stillman

    stillman Guide Bushclass I

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    Deer season is over so I'm riding again. Here's the Bianchi with Vittoria Voyager Hyper tires and very fashionable water bottles.
    The water bottles don't enhance the ride but the tires sure do. They average 20% faster than the Kendas that came stock on the bike and are very comfortable at 80psi. The width is listed as 35 but they are more like 38 and there's a little room to spare.

    bianchibike.jpg
     
  44. Newtown Mark

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    Tried, but ever got into the mountain bike.
     
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  45. 2jka

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    I haven't gotten a chance, been busy skiing and trying to convert my road bike to tubeless. I may do that today.


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  46. GeoKrpan

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    Let us know how the tubeless is going. Brionic wasn't succeeding last I heard. I think it's because he is using a folding tire and because his rim isn't tubeless with the ridge to keep the bead of the tire in place. That could be fixed with making a ridge with masking tape. However, I think that would only work with the split tube method.

     
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  47. TraditionalbyChoice

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    I really do live in a great area for riding. I plan on heading out to California this summer to my uncles to do some riding, he lives near laguna beach. He rides the moro trails. I'll probably end up demoing a bike for a week though, I'm thinking a Santa Cruz nomad cc, maybe even a Santa Cruz Bronson cc. He's friends with a bike shop owner and gets 3 free week long demos.

    I threw my bike in the stand and your right, the clutch does add some resistance.

    Got a nice little storm last night, so this weekend I'll bring the good old Husqvarna chainsaw out along with my favorite CT pattern axe. I'm sure there's a few trees down, and any I could make into log rides would be great.
     
  48. GeoKrpan

    GeoKrpan Guide

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    I've never ridden the Morro trails. I've ridden the Santa Ana River Trail off of the Ortega Highway , 74, and it is spectacular. But, nothing is going to have the type of scenery of your locale unless you go up into the mountains, the San Bernardino or San Gabriel.

    I don't mean to be mean about 1x. For expert, fit, young riders like you it's no problem.
     
  49. 2jka

    2jka Scout

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    I've given up on that for now. Currently riding my "race" wheels. They are running I think 26mm and a much lower profile rim, but are set up with a 16 tooth gear. The Shimano SS is almost silence when freewheeling witch is the weirdest thing.

    First I tried just tape and couldn't get it to work.
    Then I tried building out the center of the rim with some foam rubber adhesive insulation to make a bead catch but after breaking two tire levers I kinda gave up. Likely too much volume taken up.

    I was really trying to avoid the split tube method but it looks like that may have to be my next step.

    How does one reinstall the split tube if you want to change a tire?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  50. TraditionalbyChoice

    TraditionalbyChoice Supporter Supporter

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    Separate the split tube from the tire, then clean the surface of the split inner tube. When you are ready to set up the new tire, set it up like you would with a new tube. Repeat each time you change tires

    This should help:


    I've used split tube in the past, and I found the hassle just wasn't worth it. It's why I'm currently running 2.4-2.7 lightweight tubes on my fat bike, as split tube is the only way wienman rims could be setup tubeless.
     
    Blackhills, werewolf won and GeoKrpan like this.

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