Challenge & GAW: One stick fire with green wood round 2

Discussion in 'Edged Tools' started by Mountain Mel, Jun 11, 2019.

  1. Robert Y

    Robert Y Scout

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    I do have some mockernut hickory nearby, thanks for the suggestion.

    I agree that I will need a lot more...I've got to be able to dry out the rest of the wood once the shavings start, and I didn't have enough the first time. So far the only thing that has caught on fire has been a small bit of the scrapings, and a few feathers, and that has been after gnawing off quite a bit of ferro rod.

    Thanks for the encouragement. One of the reasons I post these learning experiences is to give a bit of accountability to go one more time.
     
  2. Kyle363

    Kyle363 Hobbyist Hobbyist Supporter

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    @Robert Y I would also say if you’re able to do it before the sun goes down leave the scraping and shavings in the sun. 10-15 min while processing everything else will really help dry them out.

    I had a downpour come through when I did my first attempt and even though I covered my scrapings and shavings they got soaked. I was able to leave the soaking wet material in the sun while I prepped everything else and it was bone dry when I got back to it.
     
  3. Vanitas

    Vanitas Supporter Supporter

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    Good advice, I did mine between thunderstorms and did the same thing.
     
  4. Robert Y

    Robert Y Scout

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    Well, finally got some success. I changed just about every variable used in the first two trials, so there is no way to know exactly what was the magic ticket. I used a different knife, new wood, Chinese privet, started at 2 in the afternoon on a bright summer day, placed my prep on top of a sheet of tin in the sun, and placed a few boiling chips (pieces of gravel inside my cup). It took 1 hour and 57 minutes, but everything burned so much easier.

    Found the tree
    IMG_20190703_135956184.jpg

    Skinned the bark and saved it. This actually became very dry by the time the fire was lit.
    IMG_20190703_140325057.jpg
    cross batoned the into four pieces
    IMG_20190703_142318334_HDR.jpg

    Finalized prep on the tin
    IMG_20190703_153907173.jpg

    Boiling chips
    IMG_20190703_154638343.jpg

    Ignition
    IMG_20190703_155003812.jpg
    Warming
    IMG_20190703_155349647.jpg
    Long-awaited success. Thanks for the tips, suggestions, and encouragement!

    IMG_20190703_155633439.jpg
     
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  5. Vanitas

    Vanitas Supporter Supporter

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    Grats! Way to stick with it.
     
  6. MrFixIt

    MrFixIt Old Jarhead LB#42 Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    Nice job @Robert Y !
    I was skeptical on the use of privet as it tends to be rather wet when green.
    Putting your prep on tin was a good idea.
     
  7. Robert Y

    Robert Y Scout

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    For some reason, I have a memory of us clearing some out and throwing it straight into a bonfire. Some told me that you can just throw it on green and it will burn. You are right that it was pretty damp in the outside after skinning the bark.
     
  8. Vanitas

    Vanitas Supporter Supporter

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    You can actually do that with a lot of green wood... it just smokes more and is harder to start initially than dry wood. Ash for instance, except black ash, is pretty easy to just cut down a tree and start a fire right up. If I'm feeling ambitious when this challenge is over I'll do a whole write up on greenwood fires.
     
  9. Beard-O

    Beard-O Scout

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    I am coming down to the last minutes of this challenge. If my next few days are free, I might just have to give it a try.

    You are forgetting a few things @Primordial
    1: I know where you live.
    2: You are forgetting I have a degree in Forestry Sciences.

    You left too many clues.
    1. The leaf alone is enough for someone that knows enough about trees to properly identify. Although this younger specimen looks to be lacking an additional "growth" that would easily identify it as well.
    2. Not too many trees have lenticels in the bark when young.
    3. Bark peels easily.
    4. Oxidation causing an orange color is a dead give away. It is due to a certain chemical. To keep your tree a mystery I will just include a picture of the chemical structure.

    imgsrv.png

    Interestingly, the oxidation of this chemical causes the orange staining, but the chemical itself is being researched as a powerful antioxidant.

    I will just stop here, so as not to give any additional clues to this "tree." Needless to say I know what you got there. ;)
     
  10. Vanitas

    Vanitas Supporter Supporter

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    The leaf, yes. It isn't the only tree with the ability to stain hands a rust orange though. If the flowers had been on the tree he'd have been in real trouble lol. Even better than an antioxident it may have beneficial effects for those with metabolic disorders by means of suppression of certain cell differentiation, though if you were aware of the chemical structure then I'm sure you were already aware of this. Though the one thing I will say, if speed is your goal for greenwood fire this is not the best tree.


    Oh and I should add.... 3 Days remaining... get to it peeps!
     
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2019
  11. R Stowe

    R Stowe MOA #61 Hobbyist Supporter Bushclass I

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    Attempt one was a flop. Maple is not an ideal wood. Learned something’s though.

    1. This modded Ontario machete is a beast, I already knew that but it was reaffirmed. Chopped, split, shavings, and scrapings all down without want for another tool.
    2. Shavings don’t light as fast you think they would.
    3. If I get another attempt more curls are needed. Like 3 or 4 times more.
    4. While the clock is an interesting addition, the fact I only had a free hour definitely added to my defeat.

    Here’s the highs and lows of the attempt.

    [​IMG]

    This maple sapling had taken a hit and half of the top was gone. Ants had moved into that wound so I predicted it wouldn’t last long anyways.

    [​IMG]

    My prep. I made sure to mix up the curls with both thick and thin varieties. That was a totally insufficient amount to get the split wood going.

    [​IMG]

    Ignition!

    [​IMG]

    It really got going but not well enough to catch the split wood. Time from the first swing of the machete to the fire dying out was 1hr 5 mins. Even if I don’t get a chance to do this during the contest I’m going to try it again with 4x curls and double scrapings. Once the initial curls get going I’ll continue adding equal sized batches to give the split wood time to dry and catch. I’m hoping it would also be enough to create some coals.

    Well done to all involved! This kind of skills practice is hard to beat.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2019
  12. Robert Y

    Robert Y Scout

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    I realized that my entry with the privet didn't have the leaves on the first pic, and I wanted to try hickory as @Vanitas had suggested. So this entry will replace that one. This challenge has been great for my skill building. Thanks again to @Mountain Mel for his generous challenge.

    I kind of felt bad taking down one of my favorite trees, but this was in a clump left over from an old stump. I'll make something nice from the rest of the sapling.
    IMG_20190706_140509836.jpg

    Cross batoned into sections

    IMG_20190706_141645843.jpg

    Prepped using my sheet of tin again. I was surprised how well the hickory made scrapings and feathers. I could also tell that hickory was by far the driest wood that I had worked with.

    IMG_20190706_150957171.jpg

    The scrapings started on the third strike from the ferro rod. I was a little over confident and put the lid on the stove early than I probably should have. As a result, I had to spend more time babying the fire than taking photos.

    IMG_20190706_152046270.jpg

    Of course few woods burn hotter than hickory once it gets going. Getting faster- 1 hr and 19 minutes. (Edit--It is probably more like 1 hr and 22 minutes since I didn't take the picture until after the sapling was cut down)

    IMG_20190706_152425275.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2019
  13. Northwest Axe

    Northwest Axe Supporter Supporter

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    Almost over everyone!!! Really excited about this one! Love seeing everyone's attempts both successful and non :)
     
  14. Mountain Mel

    Mountain Mel Supporter Supporter

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    Well that time flew by! I'm looking forward to catching up on all the posts. I'll check and comment on them tomorrow night and announce the picks. Great job everyone!
     
  15. SavageJak

    SavageJak Scout

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    Never got the chance to attempt it. Dang. Got the word that my wife is pregnant with our second (so excited) and totally forgot to set aside some time. Oh well. Good to see so many were successful! Pretty sure I would have flubbed it anyways. Haha
     
  16. MrFixIt

    MrFixIt Old Jarhead LB#42 Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    Congratulations!
     
  17. OutdoorsFamilyMan

    OutdoorsFamilyMan Supporter Supporter

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    Totally forgot about this.....grrrr...killer prizes. Been really wanting a firebox stove and i blew it lol
     
  18. Northwest Axe

    Northwest Axe Supporter Supporter

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    Bump
     
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  19. Mountain Mel

    Mountain Mel Supporter Supporter

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    sorry everyone, I had a family emergency come up. I take care of my father in law and have power of attorney for him. Unfortunately his son takes great issue with that and makes lots of trouble fro my wife and I even though he's never helped in the past and his own life is a complete mess. I try my best to take him into consideration and respect his relationship with his dad but there's reasons why both his mother and father decided not to have him take care of them in their old age. They knew they could count on me but not him.

    I know, TMI but just needed to vent a little. Anyway, I'll get crackin on the posts and start doing the drawings and posting the results asap.

    On a personal note, I really appreciate being able to live vicariously through your bushcraft activities. It may be a long time before I can spend time in the bush again like I grew up doing. Being responsible for others is hard but you and this place makes it just a little easier. Thanks everyone.

    now to start reading................please hold :)
     
  20. Mountain Mel

    Mountain Mel Supporter Supporter

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    lots of good stuff in this thread folks. I hope everyone had fun.

    do me a favor and message me if you made an attempt, successfull or not. I don't want to miss anyone.

    special shout out to 2 members. First of all congratulations @SavageJak !! maybe we can come up with a baby shower consolation prize for ya :)

    And @Vanitas you sir are something special. Using a crooked knife was unbelievable. It sure makes the point that it's the knowledge and skill and not the tool.

    I'm not sure I'll get the drawing done tonight as I'm pretty tired and need to crash but I'll try reall hard to get it done tomorrow
     
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  21. Vanitas

    Vanitas Supporter Supporter

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    Be lucky I wasn't feelin froggy... I would have used a hand saw for the whole thing.
     
  22. Mountain Mel

    Mountain Mel Supporter Supporter

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    As my father used to say "you're a piece of work" @Vanitas :)

    ok now to find that random number thingy................please hold
     
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  23. Mountain Mel

    Mountain Mel Supporter Supporter

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    Here's the 5 random picks
    @Robert Y
    @HannahT
    @Northwest Axe
    @Primordial
    @mauiarcher

    Based on time here's the order of picking prizes
    1) @Northwest Axe
    2) @Robert Y
    3) @mauiarcher
    4) @HannahT - so both @HannahT and @Primordial did it in 2hrs but @HannahT made 2 attempts so to reward her determination and effort I gave the tie breaker to her. Don't like it sue me :)
    5) @Primordial

    So @Northwest Axe you're up. Pick an item and then the next person can pick and so on. Please message me your shipping addresses.
     
  24. Mountain Mel

    Mountain Mel Supporter Supporter

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    so I just realized I screwed up. It was supposed to be 3 picks for success and then 2 picks for attempts.

    I've decided to roll with the 5 picks above for success and I'll add 2 more consolation prizes for 2 attempts.
     
  25. MrFixIt

    MrFixIt Old Jarhead LB#42 Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    No worries @Mountain Mel .
    I feel that most who participated were not really in for a prize but for the challenge itself.
    Thank you for taking the lead on this!
     
  26. Vanitas

    Vanitas Supporter Supporter

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    Grats everyone!
     
  27. Northwest Axe

    Northwest Axe Supporter Supporter

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    Holy moly!!! Thank you so much for the opportunity! This is something I will be practicing from now on and trying with different wood/tools. Great skill to have!

    I never keep any of the Hudson Bay style axes to myself ( have two Norlunds for sale soon actually) and I don't have a use for the other items so per our conversation I'd love to try the hatchet out please.

    Great job everyone @Robert Y you're up!!

    Kyle
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2019
  28. Robert Y

    Robert Y Scout

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    Thanks again @Mountain Mel. This is one of the most generous giveaways I've seen. I've learned valuable skills and enjoyed advancing my skills. Wow, what a first GAW win!! I'll take the Condor chopper and will try to put lots of miles on it. Very grateful.

    @mauiarcher you're up.

    Also, want to give a shout out to @Vanitas for the tips and mad skills with the hook knife.
     
  29. mauiarcher

    mauiarcher Supporter Supporter

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    @MrFixIt is right....definitely didnt enter for any prizes. Was a task I hadn't done before and enjoyed the learning. Plus it gave an excellent reason/excuse to really test the Nakai. Thank you again @Mountain Mel for putting this on (again) and the cool booty as a bonus. PM me and let me know what I owe for shipping. I will take the other ax or hatchet whatever is available.
     
  30. HannahT

    HannahT Firebug Hobbyist Supporter Bushclass I

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    This was an amazing challenge! A ton of fun :) I think it was the hardest thing I've ever done for the forum. It made it pretty obvious to me that I need to practice processing wood :D

    It looks like I'm up next. I think I'd like to try that Firebox stove :) Thanks a million @Mountain Mel for the GAW and @Vanitas for the advice!
     
  31. Mountain Mel

    Mountain Mel Supporter Supporter

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    ok so @Primordial is holding things up :)
    maybe somebody should start another green wood fire and send up some smoke signals :)

    I'm going to rummage through my shed of goodies and post a couple more consolation prizes tomorrow so stay tuned
     
  32. Primordial

    Primordial MOA #40 Supporter

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    No need to hold things up...I'm last to draw straws goodies, therefore by default I must get the knife. ;)

    Thanks so much for the fantastic GAW Mountain Mel! I never did a green wood one stick wonder fire so I learned a lot. I found this to be a fantastic skill exercise and encourage others to try it. I also was thoroughly entertained reading through this challenge thread.
     
  33. SavageJak

    SavageJak Scout

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    Thanks for the thought, but I was just in it for the challenge...which I am still going to do regardless just because it was such a great idea for a GAW. I appreciate the well wishes and the generous GAW chance!
     
  34. Primordial

    Primordial MOA #40 Supporter

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    I really enjoyed your hook knife madness! Insane show of green wood fire skill!
     
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  35. Mountain Mel

    Mountain Mel Supporter Supporter

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    ok @Primordial , I'll call off @Vanitas for those smoke signals but I sure would've liked to see him use his saw :)

    tomorrow I'll post the other 2 prizes

    I have a favor to ask everyone on this. I would like to compose a list of lessons learned about fire making and knife skills from this challenge. Nothing elaborate just simple to the point tips/lessons that if followed would ensure someone of very good odds of success.

    For example:
    1) Lots of fine prep, both scrapings and fine curls/shavings. I would estimate at least triple the amount you would use for a dry wood fire

    If everyone could chime in and then we'll post them all together for reference.
     
  36. Vanitas

    Vanitas Supporter Supporter

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    Tell ya what, I'll do it when I have time and ping ya in the post
     
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  37. Primordial

    Primordial MOA #40 Supporter

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    I wanted to seek out a tree species that didn't hold much water, so I went with tag alder. The tree was green and alive but in mid summer if it hasn't rained, you can almost just pop the bark off with your finger nails. I figured this would help with sustained ignition. I originally went to chop a small black ash because I know ash puts out some good BTUs but I abandoned that idea when it started to literally weep water after I hacked into it.

    I should have made more shavings but I didn't so I could save time....but that came back to bite me. I also made shavings out of my first piece of wood that I split. I let them dry in the sun while I continued to break down the tree, trying to be as efficient as I could with my time.
     
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  38. Vanitas

    Vanitas Supporter Supporter

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    Black Ash is the only Ash you can't easily light green... it has a LOT of water in it ;p
     
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  39. Robert Y

    Robert Y Scout

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    The main thing for me was to pick a day with full afternoon sun and get your scrapings finished first to dry out. My first two failures were near the end of the day on cloudy or rainy days, and the scrapings never got dry enough to light without literally hundreds of showers of sparks. On the full-sun days, less than 10 strikes were needed. I also made most of my prep about pencil lead thickness, with nothing thicker than a pencil. @NWPrimate's thread on stab splitting came in really handy. https://bushcraftusa.com/forum/thre...here-on-bcusa-stab-splitting-kindling.175302/ Actually, I also used his easy shavings method as well. https://bushcraftusa.com/forum/threads/making-curls-and-feather-sticks-the-easy-way.172519/ I like to place a block/prop behind the blade to help control the pullstick a little better.

    I ended up having way more prep than was necessary to boil water, but it's better to be safe
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2019
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  40. HannahT

    HannahT Firebug Hobbyist Supporter Bushclass I

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    I learned that my fire prep needs work - I'm way too slow! And also that wood type makes a huge difference :) It was all new to me!
     
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  41. Northwest Axe

    Northwest Axe Supporter Supporter

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    Look up trees in your area that burn well green if you don't already know. It could literally save your life! Planning ahead exactly what I was going to do, how much wood I thought I would need, how I was going to build my fire and continuing to prep after fire was lit, I was able to pretty easily get mine boiling under an hour. That was with taking pictures and starting the fire roughly 100yds from where it was cut.

    Surface area was key. Break down stuff smaller than you need and spread it out. Also ask yourself whether or not you think something will catch a spark. If your not sure, make it smaller, make it fuzzier.
    Like others said and did break down your smallest stuff first, that way it will dry a bit while you're doing your prep, granted the weather is nice. Had it been raining or really cold I would have kept shavings in my pocket close to my body heat. Also on the smaller stuff I removed as much bark as I could to remove moisture.
     
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  42. Mountain Mel

    Mountain Mel Supporter Supporter

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    I have everyone's shipping info and will be sending out the packages Thursday morning.

    Still need to head out to the shed and get a couple more items for the give away. Hopefully will et that posted tomorrow.

    Thank you very much for the lessons learned posts. Great stuff for others to learn and improve their skills.
     
  43. Mountain Mel

    Mountain Mel Supporter Supporter

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    so here's the 2 consolation prizes
    1) Mora #2/0 with kydex sheath
    2) Svord Kiwi outdoor knife (L6 carbon steel)

    special prize for a mad display of skills using a spoon knife goes to @Vanitas
    Wolfe Creek Forge Horse steel and a piece of flint

    Please hold while I randomly pick someone............
     

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  44. Mountain Mel

    Mountain Mel Supporter Supporter

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    @R Stowe is our next prize winner! Pick which item you'd like and the remaining one will go to............................... @SavageJak
     
  45. Vanitas

    Vanitas Supporter Supporter

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    Send mine to someone whom didn't win anything... I still have to do it with the hand saw :16: :4: :dblthumb:
     
  46. Mountain Mel

    Mountain Mel Supporter Supporter

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    well @Vanitas that's mighty stubborn.....and generous of you :)

    So our next winner who will get the flint and steel kit is............................... @Kyle363

    PM me your shipping addresses
     
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  47. SavageJak

    SavageJak Scout

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    Wow! I've never won for failing the hardest. lol Honestly though, thank you very much. Wifey is starting to get past the first trimester nausea, so hopefully I can get a real attempt in soon! I'll post whatever happens back here.
     
  48. Primordial

    Primordial MOA #40 Supporter

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    Robert Y and MrFixIt like this.
  49. MrFixIt

    MrFixIt Old Jarhead LB#42 Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    Primordial likes this.
  50. Mountain Mel

    Mountain Mel Supporter Supporter

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    yo, calling @R Stowe you out there bud?
    maybe we should send some smoke signals his way :)
     
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