Pogonip forming...

Discussion in 'General Bushcraft Discussion' started by NevadaBlue, Jan 11, 2019.

  1. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    Freezing fog, called pogonip here. It started forming last night. A flashlight makes a cone shaped beam in the fog. The frozen fog is still forming tonight so I decided to try some pics.

    The tree in our back yard has about 1” long Pogonip on it.

    This is what it looks like with the light from the porch light only.

    6C9F1B68-11E6-496A-99B5-BDE14E3B960E.jpeg

    And here is the same view using the flash.

    6EA77976-9565-490B-B2B8-9683974A6A36.jpeg

    The flash catches the fog so you can see what is freezing on the tree. Pretty cool.
    (Literally cool, about 20 degrees)
     
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  2. Griff4570

    Griff4570 Tracker

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    Great pictures. Been getting some freezing fog here in Central Oregon the last couple days.
     
  3. Youcantreadinthedark

    Youcantreadinthedark Amphibian. Supporter Bushclass I

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    Man I have heard some really cool words in my life, but I have never heard that one. Thanks for the pictures.
     
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  4. gohammergo

    gohammergo I like sharp things.... Supporter Bushcraft Friend

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    That is amazing! What beauty. :)
     
  5. Primordial

    Primordial MOA #40 Supporter Bushcraft Friend

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  6. hillst1

    hillst1 Supporter Supporter

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    Very cool. We call that hoarfrost here in NC.
     
  7. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    We are having fun here. The word is a distorted version of a Shoshone word.

    From some online dictionary...
    So what's a pogonip? In the mountains of the western United States, the fog condenses into tiny, biting ice particles in extremely cold weather. The English-speaking settlers who encountered this unpleasant and sometimes scary phenomenon when they went out West in the 1800s needed a word for it. They borrowed "payinappih" ("cloud") from Shoshone, altering it to "pogonip."

    ———
    I also read that water droplets can remain liquid down to -40!!!

    From wikipedia:

    Ice fog is a type of fog consisting of fine ice crystals suspended in the air. It occurs only in cold areas of the world, as water droplets suspended in the air can remain liquid down to −40 °C. It should be distinguished from diamond dust, a precipitation of sparse ice crystals falling from a clear sky. Wikipedia

    And our trivia for the day is:

    -40C = -40F

    Amazing.
     
  8. mtnoutdoors

    mtnoutdoors Prov 27:17 Supporter

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    Cool but man that is crazy.
    Stay safe brother. Prov 27:17
     
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  9. DCPugh

    DCPugh Supporter Supporter Bushcraft Friend

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    That is pretty cool, we’re supposed to be getting close to 10” of snow this weekend so I will have to keep an eye out for some frozen fog also.
     
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  10. Stone

    Stone Bushmaster

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    That "diamond dust" is pretty fun stuff! I've seen it when the sun is bright without a cloud in the sky. I figured it was just moisture freezing out of the air and 'snowing.'' I've usually seen this when it is somewhere around twenty or thirty below zero F.
     
  11. bush-hunter

    bush-hunter Scout

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    @NevadaBlue i asked genius wife what -40c = in Fahrenheit she made as much sense as the question.

    Then I asked how to spell Fahrenheit.

    Im going to need to look at manual thermometer in the morning its cold and blowing now.
     
  12. bush-hunter

    bush-hunter Scout

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    Im guessing zero but she still dont care. But did like the pictures you took.
     
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  13. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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  14. Beach Hiker

    Beach Hiker Traveller Supporter Bushcraft Friend

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    @NevadaBlue
    How does it feel breathing that air? Pretty amazing I'm guessing....
     
  15. bush-hunter

    bush-hunter Scout

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    Yeah she showed me the same formula. I like the metric system weights and measures. Celcius to Fahrenheit has no good sense.

    Thank you sir.
     
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  16. x39

    x39 Hyperborean Supporter

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    I spent some time in Fairbanks, AK many years ago. The ice fog was nothing short of amazing, I mean so thick people were driving with their doors open so they could see the lines in the road. There were chain link fences next to some of the roads, and the frost would settle on them to the extent you couldn't see through them (there's very little wind there). Viewed from above, the fog hung low in the city, with chimneys and smoke stacks visible above it. In my mind it looked like the whole place had been flattened by a big bomb and just the ruins were sticking up out of the smoke. My understanding was that the fog was caused by moisture released with tailpipe and heating emissions hitting the very cold air.
     
  17. A Seedy Lot

    A Seedy Lot Scout

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    Similar phenomenon of ice/snow happens in the mountains around here. The trees in the mountains get coated in rime snow, they are called snow ghosts. I was on the mountain a month ago and while we were in the summit house warming up for 20 minutes 3/8 of an inch of rime formed on our ski poles. The temperture was 16 degrees Fahrenheit with 20 to 30 mile an hour winds and wet snow. Here is a photo I found on Google of snow ghosts.

    images.jpg
     
  18. NattyBo

    NattyBo Supporter Supporter

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    Just learned about rime from one of Takashi kajihara day hike posts. Pretty cool stuff.
     
  19. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    I can feel the stuff on my skin and see it in the air, but haven’t noticed feeling it while breathing it. This morning the frost is much thicker, the tree limbs are fat and white. There is no sky, just white.

    E8A1082B-8B3B-43B8-9D84-EA08B6DA8BFC.jpeg
     
  20. HannahT

    HannahT Firebug Hobbyist Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    Wow! There's a Louis L'Amour story that mentions a pogonip fog but I'd never seen it before.
     
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  21. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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  22. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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  23. Wyanokie

    Wyanokie Supporter Supporter

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    Eerie! Thank you for sharing.

    Not the same as pogonip, but I remember years ago (might have been 1995) we had a lot of ice storms on the East Coast. One evening I looked out and the trees all looked like they were made of glass and the light of the setting sun was passing through many of them. It was almost otherworldly. Wish I had a photo...
     
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  24. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    Ice storms are very neat looking. I have pics somewhere of some. One took down a TV tower when I lived in ND. (Remember TV towers?) We lost a station for a LONG time over that one.
     
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  25. schapm

    schapm Incompetent City Dweller Supporter

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    We just learned this word last week! My wife does a word of the week for homeschooling and pogonip was on a list she was looking through.
     
  26. JeffG

    JeffG Scout

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    We call it hoarfrost in Wisconsin also. The name gets snickers and giggles from the kids...
     
  27. Primordial

    Primordial MOA #40 Supporter Bushcraft Friend

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    Your schooling efforts must work, because I have never heard that word in my life until this thread lol.
     
  28. Toytech

    Toytech Scout

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    Hoarfrost up here in Canada as well , big difference here though is that happens on warm winter days .
     
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  29. S.Decker

    S.Decker Guide

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    My missus is a native Wisconsinite, and I had to EXPLAIN hoarfrost to her:rolleyes:. She didn't know what it waso_O. Heck, even I know what it is, and, I'm from Pennsylvania. I think she's a communist, or something.
     
  30. fishiker

    fishiker Scout

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  31. A Seedy Lot

    A Seedy Lot Scout

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    Hoarfrost in the mountains often becomes a weak layer buried within a snowpack and potetially is the failing layer for avalanche formation. If the weather is cold and no wind i have seen hosrfrost crystals almost 2 inches tall.

    I was elk hunting a few years and found myself upon a little lake deep in the mountains. The lake was covered in hoarfrost and every step was accompanied buy gentle tinkle of breaking crystals.
     
  32. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    This stuff is amazing. This morning the fog is back and the pogonip is still growing. It is an odd looking mix of ‘styrofoam frost’ and crystals. VERY lightweight and fragile. This is the 3rd day it has been around this time. Any movement more than the slightest breeze knocks it off.
    I have been trying to upload a new pic from yesterday evening, I will try again.
     
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  33. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    It is over 2” long in places now, looks like another half inch overnight.

    7B6FE0D0-7C2A-45C3-B3CB-6A414B77ECA4.jpeg
     
  34. MountainWanderer

    MountainWanderer Scout

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    ‘pogonip’ - I just had to check out what that word means when seeing the thread title ;)

    This morning we have freezing fog - ‘pogonip’ - here. I went outside while it was still dark with my headlight on. Couldn’t see beyond a few feet in front of me - - just whiteness. It’s starting to slowly dissipate, though. There were a few things I wanted to pick up at the store, but I think I’ll wait a few hours. The roads are slicker than snot
     
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  35. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    The sky cleared this afternoon and I waddled out under the tree. The Nevada Blue sky is so beautiful looking through this tree, it almost hurts to look at it.
     
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  36. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    A1884182-3F21-4BF3-939B-8D1CF078B976.jpeg

    Then the fog rolled back over us and it started building more frost.
     
  37. bacpacjac

    bacpacjac Supporter Supporter Bushclass I

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    That's really beautiful, Ken!~
     
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  38. bacpacjac

    bacpacjac Supporter Supporter Bushclass I

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  39. DavidJAFO

    DavidJAFO Supporter Supporter

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    hello,
    @NevadaBlue I haven't seen pogonip (hoarfrost) in the locality since last January when we had a very bad spell of 'waehter' (see what I did there)? :rolleyes: the weather has been very mild of late & very little snow in the Scottish lowlands. :( We used to have some of the harshest winters imaginable with very deep snow, you'd have to travel up to the Scottish highlands to see proper deep snow. We've had some haar of late, which occurs when warm air moves over the cooler rivers Clyde & Avon nearby, causing moisture in the air to condense & form haar aka freezing fog. If it is cold enough, pogonip does form on the trees through the haar. I took a photo of the last sunset 24th December 2018 as the haar was forming when the temperature was dropping way below zero out by the Whitelees wind farm. https://www.scottishpower.co.uk/whitelee/
    Regards
    David
     
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  40. DavidJAFO

    DavidJAFO Supporter Supporter

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    hello,
    :8: slightly O.T up in the Scottish highlands it has been so cold, there have been reports of ice pancakes forming on the Scottish rivers & estuaries. They are not a common sight in Scotland, but have been recorded on a few rivers over the past few years during sub zero temperatures. The Glasgow Meterological Office said, they were most frequently found in the Baltic Sea & around Antarctica, & were also seen in the US & Canada.
    Regards
    David

    [​IMG]
     
  41. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    Jacqui, it is a cow skull that normally hangs on our front porch. We had taken it down to make room for the Christmas decorations. It is still laying on the porch rail and had collected snow and pogonip. Tell the kids it is a dinosaur. ;) Or the skull of a giant Nevada ice kangaroo. :4:

    Wow, David, that is a neat picture. I have seen ice form things sort of like that, but those are perfect.
     
  42. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    I am having trouble uploading pics. If I succeed, be sure to click on some of the photos for more detail.

    DCC5BC8B-8B0B-47BF-8DC3-D0A7D32C5BC1.jpeg

    That is looking due west in front of our house.

    6981A1BD-C20E-411B-8261-4147353424DB.jpeg

    Tire track in the driveway.

    FF1A6483-D661-479E-8480-27BA809C7668.jpeg

    Click on that one and look at the crystals.
     
  43. DavidJAFO

    DavidJAFO Supporter Supporter

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    hello,
    @NevadaBlue I am sooo jealous ^^^^ :17: boo hoo.. sob sob.. I think I need a short vacation up in the Scottish Highlands between January - April during the snowfall :cool: brrrr..
    Regards
    David
     
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  44. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    Take pics! :D
     
  45. Mookietherooster

    Mookietherooster Supporter Supporter Bushcraft Friend Banned

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  46. A Seedy Lot

    A Seedy Lot Scout

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  47. A Seedy Lot

    A Seedy Lot Scout

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    Last picture from me since the inversion, mid elevation fog layer, is lifting and snow is in the forecast. Skied into the mountains today and travelled through a deep surface hoar layer which is going to be the starting zone for many avalanches as the winter continues. I love the sound of breaking ice crystals.

    20190116_105659.jpg
     
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  48. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushcraft Friend Bushclass I

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    Oh, breaking ice... one of my favorite things to do as a kid. The creek in the woods behind us was always fair game. :)

    The pogonip is gone from here. Such fleeting beauty. It warmed up during the night and the wind came up and everything is back to it’s normal winter skeletons. Was fun while it lasted.
     
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  49. A Seedy Lot

    A Seedy Lot Scout

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    Avalanche Danger...THE AVALANCHE DANGER WILL RISE TO HIGH BY
    FRIDAY OR SATURDAY.

    * Reason/Impacts...CONTINUOUS SNOWFALL WITH INCREASING WINDS WILL
    OVERLOAD A VERY FRAGILE SNOW SURFACE, CAUSING WIDESPREAD NATURAL
    AVALANCHE ACTIVITY.

    Todays weather warning as a snow event engulfs us. The fragile snow surface is the surface hoar that formed during the inversion.
     

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