Sleep System Layering

Discussion in 'Winter Camping' started by CharClothed, Oct 5, 2018.

  1. CharClothed

    CharClothed Supporter Supporter

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    So I know a lot of you guys do layering when setting something on the ground to sleep on. What is your ground pad layering system that goes below the sleeping bag? My sleeping pad causes me to fall off all the time so looking at alternatives.
     
  2. Walking Crow

    Walking Crow Supporter Supporter

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    Age has reduced my enthusiasm for winter camping, but before the slowdown my system had evolved to this:
    1. Grabber "Space Blanket" on the bottom, silver side up. This was as much for a waterproof layer and a bright surface to help me find things without always having to find my glasses first, as it was for its radiant heat reflective properties.
    2. Full length Ridge Rest (the thicker version) or a Z-rest closed cell pad
    3. 3/4 length Thermarest pad.

    I'm mostly a side sleeper and I would usually "bottom out" the Thermarest at shoulder and hip, but it seemed to add some insulation overall. Before I got hooked on Wiggy's bags, I used an old Eddie Bauer Kara Korum down bag with this base. If it wasn't going to be terribly windy or snow, I often just slept without an additional shelter, adding a tarp to deal with wind and/or snow.

    For sub zero trips, where packing space permitted, I took a 2nd closed cell pad instead of the Thermarest. I now have an insulated air mattress that I would substitute for the Thermarest or the 2nd closed cell foam, but I haven't ventured out, having had only one spell of sub zero temps in the last several years. Perhaps this winter will be different.

    I did add a USGI Bivy a few times. Putting the pads inside seemed to keep things together, but it was crowded.

    Hope this has helped you a bit in your planning.
     
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  3. RobbieinME

    RobbieinME Scout

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    Sportsmans/causulty blanket, USGI iso pad, EXPED 9 DLX, zero degree 40yr old sierra Designs down bag, with a USGI green patrol bag and USGI gortex bivy. Slept down to -10-20F.
     
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  4. trailhermit

    trailhermit Scout

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  5. trailhermit

    trailhermit Scout

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    The thin light foam pad can go under whatever air pad you might normally use. I have used mine in a hammock and in a tent along with my klymet inflatable pad. I also carry the Thermarest Z seat which I use under my feat when sleeping.
     
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  6. PACoureurDuBois

    PACoureurDuBois For God and Country Supporter

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    Outside:
    • Bivy bag.

    Inside, from bottom to top:
    • Teton foam sleeping pad,
    • Harbor freight "wool" blanket folded in half and laid on.
    • Me, wrapped in woobie
    • 100% wool blanket wrapped around woobie and me.
     
  7. trailhermit

    trailhermit Scout

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    I may have to try that set up. I like the idea of the woobie protecting me from the HF "wool" blanket. It may even work in my hammock. (Disclaimer: I live in the south. It's not like the temps are going to drop much below freezing.)
     
  8. Usingmyrights

    Usingmyrights Supporter Supporter

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    I got a Xterm as part of a camping lot and that thing will cook you. I've got into the 50s with nothing but a thin top blanket and the 20s with my sleeping bag without issue.
     
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  9. SkipJunkie

    SkipJunkie Scout

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    Grabber on the ground , reflective side up . Bivy bag with 3/4 blue pad , klymit Z and a -20 Down sleeping bag .
     
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  10. marbleman

    marbleman Supporter Supporter

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    I'm not familiar with winter camping. When you guys sleep at sub-zero temps, are you sleeping comfortably, or is it "Woohoo, I didn't die!"
     
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  11. Haggis

    Haggis Bushmaster

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    I’ve shivered all night in very real danger at -30 in a too light bag, and I’ve slept in absolute comfort at the same temps in a too warm bag. Overkill with bag and ground pad(s) is a good thing in chilly weather.
     
  12. Moondog55

    Moondog55 Guide

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    Comfort naturally, anything else is just dumb, but I admit that I like my comfort and perform badly if I don't sleep well.
    Sleeping well and surviving must surely be totally different poker games?
    The sheer bulk and weight of a winter mattress system is a bit daunting though, mine is adding up to weigh as much or more than the down sleeping bag and synthetic overbag combined
     
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  13. Berner9

    Berner9 Adventure Often! Supporter

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    Gossamer gear Polycro or tyvek then Gossamer gear 1/8 and large Thermarest Xtherm. 3/8th GG foam if really cold.
     
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  14. James Levite

    James Levite Tracker

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    I use a simple Closed cell foam pad as my base. It also serves as a seat. Insulated luxe inflatable mattress. I have several down quilts in different weights I can choose from depending on time and temps.
     
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  15. JC1

    JC1 Guide

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    I'm looking for a cot
     
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  16. NevadaBlue

    NevadaBlue —- Roughian #7 -— --- Graybeard -— Supporter Bushclass I

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    I got a cot.
     
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  17. gohammergo

    gohammergo I like sharp things.... Supporter Bushcraft Friend

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    I sleep on a cot every night. :)
     
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  18. Dave L.

    Dave L. Scout

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    Last weekend car camping we used: Puzzle foam (2/3" closed cell foam mat from Amazon Basics), a 4'x6' sheet of Reflectix, a Klymit Insulated Double V, and a 1.5" thick open cell egg crate foam Mat from Walmart.
    Overkill but the wife and I slept great.

    If it was just me and I was using a pack and or sled, I would use my 24"x 6' roll of reflectix, Thermarest Z-Fold closed cell foam mat and Klymit Insulated Static V.
     
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  19. Moondog55

    Moondog55 Guide

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    I need a cot myself these days but I put the insulation under it; where it won't get compressed.
    Layering for insulation is one thing and that's easy as insulation and R-Values are cumulative, comfort I found much harder to achieve but luckily we live in an affluent society and even comfort is achievable given money.
    I've found insulation relatively cheap and comfort relatively expensive and the cheaper the insulation the more robust it is or seems to be.
    Cheap and tough, blue CCF and Ensolite [ Ensolite is much tougher but heavier and I don't have such a pad any more] less cheap and tough but still reliable the old Cascade Designs shaped pads such as the RidgeRest and Z-Lite, then comes the foam filled mats like the original ThermaRest etc.
    Old. stiff and cranky if I don't sleep well I use a Sea to Summit comfort plus these days and add CCF pads and or a RidgeRest to achieve the warmth and safety factor I perceive to need. For car camping I have splurged a bit and as a couple we now have S2S self inflating mats extra wide and extra deep that come the closest to a real mattress I have come across at such a low weight but in terms of reliability I still have a T'Rest CampRest Deluxe that is as good as ever but too heavy except when using the car to carry the gear.
    So for my planned Northern winter bucket list trip and temperatures that may get down to -55C [ worst case scenario] I am bringing the S2S Comfort+ mat for comfort and I will layer that with a RidgeRest Solar long/wide and a cheaper CCF pad at least 12mm thick and deal with the stiffness factor as and when it occurs, perhaps by using the Taco-Roll method of packing the mat and sleeping bag on top of the sleds as an integrated unit
     
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  20. PACoureurDuBois

    PACoureurDuBois For God and Country Supporter

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    This reminds me of that caveman movie The Croods. Everytime something bad happens they count each other and go, "Yay, still alive!!!"
     
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  21. mtwarden

    mtwarden roaming the Big Sky Supporter

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    I always use a Xtherm pad (5.7 r value)- I'm comfortable into the teens w/ just this pad; if I'm expecting lower temps I augment the inflatable with various ccf pads- thin (1/8") to thick (z-rest) depending on temps

    lots of folks don't pay close enough attention to what's under them and complain about their sleeping bag/quilt not being warm enough
     
  22. UAHiker

    UAHiker Supporter Supporter

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    another xtherm fan. i'll put ground cloth down (polycro or similar), xtherm and that's it. i've taken it down to single digits if not 0 with just EE 10 degree and appropriate clothing and been nice and comfortable :)
     
  23. Jeremy Hess

    Jeremy Hess Tracker

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    Normal temperatures down to 40F
    USGI gortex bivy
    Snugpac jungle bag

    40F-20F
    USGI gortex bivy
    Snugpac jungle bag
    Snugpac sleeping bag liner

    20f down to -38F (coldest I've gotten to be in)
    USGI gortex bivy
    Snugpac 0 degree mummy bag
    Snugpac jungle bag
    Snugpac sleeping bag liner

    If the ground was uncomfortable moss or other natural material was placed under bivy. I've used this system mt entire time overseas in the mountains of spain and on all my trips to norway and sweden and still use it today up in the Olympics and all over washington state west side in the rain and central in the easton area and eastern out to spokane. It worked well when I was working in montana and camped out due to not having a location to stay and no paycheck yet to afford a room.
     
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  24. Juany118

    Juany118 Supporter Supporter

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    Variations of the following.
    1. Therm-a-rest Z-lite
    2. 2go system Trifecta 3rd gen in bivvy mode.
    3. Inside #2 a Klymit insulated UL pad
    4. REI 20 degree bag.
    5. If needed a Sea to Summit Reactor Plus liner.

    I probably don't need the Z-lite pad, that's more insurance, the Klymit has an R-Value of 4.4 on it's own the Z-lite is 2.6 so a total R-Value of 7. Having the Klymit inside the Trifecta (which can be a tarp, bivvy, blanket or match coat) does a good job of keeping me "on it." If you aren't familiaf with the Trifecta is basically Tyvex, which has been softened in a washing machine, with a heat reflective interior similar to an emergency "space blanket"
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2018
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  25. Juany118

    Juany118 Supporter Supporter

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    Oh, note when using a space blanket, Trifecta, SOL escape bivvy, basically anything that is using a reflective material to bounce back heat, you need "air space" otherwise the reflective material acts as a conductor and takes your body heat away.
     
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  26. Jm417

    Jm417 Tinder Gatherer

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    bottom to top
    cheap foam yoga mat
    klymit static v insulated (R4.4)
    Sea to Summit fleece reactor liner
    enlightened equipment revolution down quilt, 30 degrees
    extra wool blanket just in case
    and I wear just base layer, wool hat and insulated socks to bed. comfortable down to about 10 degrees F.
     
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  27. dmilloutside

    dmilloutside Tracker

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    USGI Bivy, Slumberjack Sleeping Bag, (variation of the following depending on temp), Cabelas cot pad, Reflectix layer, Harbor Freight moving blanket, Thermarest . I've use a cot since I've gotten older and wiser.
     
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  28. lopie

    lopie Scout

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    Have you tried putting your pad inside your bag?
     
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  29. racetrack

    racetrack Supporter Supporter

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    Have to be careful with this. Depending on how much room to start with, the pad in there with you can compress the loft and work to a disadvantage.
     
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  30. lopie

    lopie Scout

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    But if he's falling off his pad..
     
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  31. Portage_Monster

    Portage_Monster Experiencing Wanderlust Supporter

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    Blue trap - for waterproofing
    Exped Synmat 7 wrapped in a wool blanket
    0* down bag
    sometimes a blanket over the top
     
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  32. arleigh

    arleigh Guide

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    If I ever need to sleep in snow again this is what I'd do .
    I have some boogie boards kids use in the serf. kinda of a rigid foam and has a nylon sheet for the base, and handles .
    Primary use as a sled for hauling stuff on the snow, secondary use as a sleeping pad on the snow seeing my head and torso are the most critical.
    If I'm trekking snow I'm wearing snow shoes or cross country skis and carrying the gear required to survive for some time even though it might just be a day hike. I know better.
    The back pack and all the gear would ride the sled spreading the weight better across the surface . drawn by ski polls and harness .
    If I know that I must cross frozen lakes it is all that much more important to spread out the load much as possible .
    I use boogie boards during the summer as well when I must get under the car for servicing it. they slide around nicely on dirt the way a creeper does on concrete .
    I haven't been in a while but if I go to the ocean I'd be using them for diving (FLAG)
     
  33. racetrack

    racetrack Supporter Supporter

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    From a framed up bed,
    [​IMG]Copy KIMG0146 by Racetrack, on Flickr

    To just a couple of logs you drag in

    [​IMG]KIMG0145 by Racetrack, on Flickr

    [​IMG]KIMG0571 by Racetrack, on Flickr

    These no slip mats help a lot too. Protect the good pads from the sharp spots. They go from thin yoga mats on up to at least this.


    [​IMG]KIMG0587 by Racetrack, on Flickr
     
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  34. TheRambler

    TheRambler Scout

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    An alternative to buying a new nonslip mat would be to add a few pieces on grip tape on your existing pad. I found this to work well in my sons hammock to prevent his pad from sliding around, would imagine it would work just as well on the ground.
     

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