Small town/rural crime

Discussion in 'Firearms' started by Black Jaque Janaviac, Jun 14, 2018.

  1. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Scout

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    I have always been a small town - rural life person. My skill set involves situational awareness for environmental hazards such as hypothermia avoidance, staying "found", and the myriad of ways the natural environment tries to kill you.

    However it seems that our small town is being invaded by urbanites. I'm in my 40s so maybe it's my perception - but I have good reason to think it is not just me getting older.

    A) A local police officer told my young scouts in a presentation that in our small city our police force had to go from a part-time drug officer to two full-time positions in the course of a few years.
    B) I am noticing people on sidewalks that don't seem to be from around here. I'm not basing this judgement on the color of skin but on their clothing and style choices. They look like they come from big-city streets. Only recently have our industries begun hiring - so maybe, maybe they are coming here for the work. But . . . I don't know.
    C) There was a murder a few blocks away from my house. The police put up tape and had squads watching the house round-the-clock. There must have been some evidence there that was rather important. They don't do that for the typical domestic violence murder.
    D) That same house had been using a red front-porch light. Up until the murder, I would drive by and chuckle to myself and wonder if the people were just naïve and didn't know what red-light district was. After the murder I have to wonder if the people knew exactly what the red light meant and that was precisely why it was on.
    E) While cleaning my garage, I had an encounter with a guy walking down the sidewalk. I looked up and greeted him with, "How's it going?" He strutted a little further before turning around and very cockily told me, "Fine! And we're going to keep it that way!"
    F) My brother - living a couple miles outside another small town had an encounter where an criminal thought to be armed and dangerous was chased onto his property by the sheriff's deputies. They caught the guy but told my brother they had reason to believe the guy was armed. When they caught him they did not find the firearm on his person nor in his vehicle. So they cautioned my brother that the weapon could be on his property.
    G) My son was bicycling on a bike trail (decked out in road-racing gear) and was run off the trail deliberately by some tattooed dude smoking a dooby and riding a power-assisted bike.

    All this has happened within the last 2 years. Am I crazy? Have times changed?

    If I'm not crazy, what to do about it:

    I could potentially move to another small town, or perhaps move just out of town. However, I get the impression that this is a dynamic that might be widespread. Is this happening in small towns across the U.S.? Can it be escaped?

    Or maybe running from the problem is not the answer. . .
     
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  2. Paulyseggs

    Paulyseggs Supporter Supporter

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    Things are tough all over.

    Don't know what else to tell you
     
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  3. Riverpirate

    Riverpirate Supporter Supporter

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    Welcome to my world. Now we got outsiders pushing for Sunday alcohol sales!
     
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  4. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Scout

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    OK, so I take it from Pauly and Riverpirate that your experience is similar - big-city crime coming to small towns.

    In other words - you can't run from it?
     
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  5. JAY

    JAY Guide

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    In my opinion, the more the drug problem the more the crime, and in my 70 years I have seen major changes in society. Even walking the trails I always keep the look out for dangers. That includes the two lag variety. And I live 6 miles from a town, that is so small, that if you blink you will miss it.
     
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  6. werewolf won

    werewolf won TANSTAAFL Supporter Bushcraft Friend

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    Same BS here. I live in a small town that is adjacent to one of the worst cities in the State. Our police log used to be published once a week and it was maybe 3” of space in the paper. These days it is published daily and it’s several inches long; and the content has gone from person hit a deer, barking dog, Joe’s cow got loose etc to B&E, armed assaults, drug busts, domestics etc.
     
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  7. Riverpirate

    Riverpirate Supporter Supporter

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    Nope. It is why I carry everywhere I go. I can't run from it anymore. So I have to be prepared for it.
     
  8. PAcanis

    PAcanis Supporter Supporter

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    I'm not sure what constitutes big city crime.

    The little farm town I live in was known for dog fighting rings since I was a kid (I'll be 59 this year). The high school, at least had, a heroin problem. They literally could not expel any more kids (who knew there was a state quota?). One of the local names (seems like every small town has some family names that go way back) just killed his ex, her BF and himself with a gun. Gotta keep you doors locked on your vehicle, too.
    I do not notice anyone out of the ordinary. Same short, squat folks who wear slippers to the grocery store and women who like to color their hair blue or pink. Every week the town paper has domestic disturbances, both inside the home and in the streets.

    Seems crime is crime around these parts, be it small town or the city. At least as long as I can remember. Wasn't there a push after WWII for folks starting families to move out of the city? That was a little before my time. But it seems to me if your town isn't growing it's dying. We've got those small towns around here, too. Some you can't even get gas in anymore.

    Not sure what all this has to do with Firearms anyway.
     
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  9. Wasp

    Wasp We are GO for Sting! Supporter

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    I think living in the country these days a lot of people are complacent to the idea that something bad can happen. Yes I lived in the country growing up and half my adult life.

    Sure small towns are safer, exponentially so, and you know quite a few people and they know people you know through them etc, and it is good that way. Generally you xan expect to be safer in a small town than a larger one and especially the burbs or city.

    Still, there is more than enough crime in the rural areas/country and always has been. Think of moonshiners, dope growers, cock/dog fights, and even the idiot that drinks and gets belligerent down the road from you. There were places near where I lived thst the cops wouldn't go! Criminal country people with a dozen families living in one neighborhood are dangerous too. Add that to the meth epidemic and the fact that cities have resources to address it and small towns dont, so they move to where there is less pressure and cheaper homes/property, which meand down the road from you.

    Then there's the fact that when you are out of work there is nowhere to work, and that still drives already uneducated, criminally prone, or just desperate individuals thst have no other means to petty crime which can easily overlap into serious crime if they are caught in the middle of it.

    I lived at the end of a dirt road in a town where there were 1200 population, 100 miles from little rock. I would have people pull un my very private and secluded driveway which is marked and gated btw. They would sit and look at the house waiting for movement, look at the stuff in the shed and drive close to it through my yard, or even get out and "look around". I would put my gun on my belt and my Boxer and I would see if I could "assist them" in any way. Most would choke, a few were legitimately turned around and had a story that made sense and thanked me. None got the benefit of the doubt but I was reasonable when I could be.

    I have never been less vigilant in the rural/country than in the city, but I do feel more comfortable and at ease in those areas than the city, and most of the time there is honestly less problems and crime.

    Get to know a few close neighbors that you can trust, watch for them and they watch for you. Lock your doors, it isn't the 1950s anymore. Get a dog. Carry a firearm everywhere everyday like you would anywhere.
    Relax and be friendly and helpful when you can, firm when you cant/shouldn't.
     
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  10. Zunga

    Zunga Bushmaster

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    Happening here to. Both the civic rules and housing prices have become excessive in the cities. My particular area has the added disadvantage of looking idyllic. We get a lot of folks from the city trying to kick a drug habit. They think you can't find hard drugs in the country. That is very far from the truth. Only difference in a small town is everyone knows who the drug dealers are. The kid in the fancy car. In a place where above minimum wage is considered a good job! Never met a dealer who was anything other than a moron.
    Cheers Jim
     
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  11. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Scout

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    "The little farm town I live in was known for dog fighting rings since I was a kid."

    No. There's no difference between a robbery in a small town vs. a robbery in a big city. And yes there were always small towns that had their reputations, and family names that had their reputations too. However, if you were willing to sacrifice career and entertainment options it seemed like the U.S. had numerous, sleepy, small towns where you could let your kids wander without much fear.

    You could deal with crime, simply by living in an area where crime was rare. Do those places exist anymore?

    It has to do with firearms because if the answer to the above question is "no, there is no place where crime is low", then the only option is to turn and confront the problem. And that could involve concealed carry and using a firearm to defend oneself.

    I'm a bushcrafter - not a city-slicker. I'm accustomed to carrying guns, but not when I'm in the city limits of a small town because the need for such defense seemed unwarranted. I came to this site because I thought I'd catch a good concentration of small-town dwellers who might be able to tell me that what is happening in my small town is isolated and that their small town is doing just fine. In which case I would give some serious consideration and effort to relocating my family to a better small town.

    On the other hand, if the consensus seems to be that this is the times we live in and there is no escaping it by moving to a better small town, then I will focus my efforts on things like teaching my family (the women too) to shoot, enrolling in karate classes, and doing things that seem appropriate to address such changes in our world.

    This is nothing more than good wilderness survival thinking. You see conditions changing around you and you make preparations. If a snowstorm is bearing down there are things you need to do. If some other @!$%-storm is bearing down there are other things you need to do.
     
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  12. Riverpirate

    Riverpirate Supporter Supporter

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    But you live in PA soooo...lol
     
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  13. Park Swan

    Park Swan Maker Vendor

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    I really don't think it's as general as city vs rural. It really depends on where you are, but right now all across the country there are major drug problems that don't discriminate between race, creed, or class, but there are trends. I can only speak for near where I know, and around here the cities are infested with heroin while the rural areas are infested with meth. Different types of drugs and different types of crime, but you gotta be aware of what's going on in your AO.
     
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  14. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Scout

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    "I think living in the country these days a lot of people are complacent to the idea that something bad can happen"

    Yep. Although I wouldn't consider it complacent. There are risks if you do and another set of risks if you don't. For example perhaps a family weighs the odds of their toddler getting locked out of the house when temps are below zero vs. the chances of a home invasion and thus keep the doors unlocked during the day. Depending on where you live one risk is greater than the other.

    There were always murders in rural areas and small towns, but going about armed wasn't necessary because the risks were avoidable. Don't go into that bar, don't get involved with drugs, don't sleep with another man's wife - you don't need to carry and millions of rural folks have lived to ripe old ages without carrying simply by following such wisdom.

    However - I'm beginning to thing those days may be coming to a close.

    It isn't the first time in this country's history when the bushcrafters had to be vigilant for two-legged predators. It was a constant reality for Daniel Boone, Jed Smith, and Jim Bridger.
     
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  15. PAcanis

    PAcanis Supporter Supporter

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    Are we high on the crime chart?
    I don't keep up with those things.
     
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  16. PAcanis

    PAcanis Supporter Supporter

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    Ain't that the truth.
    If you don't think crime can happen in a rural setting you are living in a bubble.
     
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  17. Riverpirate

    Riverpirate Supporter Supporter

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    No you are north of the Mason Dixon line....lol. It was a joke.
     
  18. ezra45

    ezra45 Supporter Supporter Bushclass I

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    Google "The American Redoubt"...
     
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  19. Wasp

    Wasp We are GO for Sting! Supporter

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    No, crime is extremely low in a small town, and its not a whole lot different than its ever been. But if you'v been pretending your whole life that because you live in a small town nothing bad could happen to you, then you've been lying to yourself your whole life.

    Are some small towns are better/safer than others? Yep. The ones with more traditional and a close community have less issues. Despite popular modern definition "comminity" isn't simply where you live, its how the people that live there interact and address issues with one another, together, regularly. That (community) is better or worse depending on where you live, and small town/country people generally do it much better.

    There is nowhere that is "crime free" never has been. But there are places with less crime. You still need to be prepared and vigilant. Your wife and kids should still know to look out for themselves, what is out of place, follow your gut, and even how to defend themselves if need be no matter where they live, including any small town anywhere.
     
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  20. Riverpirate

    Riverpirate Supporter Supporter

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    The point is it used to not be that way. At least here in the south. We grew up knowing Atlanta was a bad, rough place. But until just a few years ago, nobody locked their doors, or carried for protection. We carried because we lived in the country and might want to just shoot something like a stop sign. Now days doors are locked and we carry for protection.
     
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  21. MrMurphy

    MrMurphy Tracker

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    Its not really worse, just now you are aware of it.
     
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  22. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Scout

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    "If you don't think crime can happen in a rural setting you are living in a bubble."

    "But if you'v been pretending your whole life that because you live in a small town nothing bad could happen to you, then you've been lying to yourself your whole life."

    OK. No. no. just no.

    I never pretended that nothing bad could happen to me in my life. I didn't live in a bubble. There are lots of bad things that could happen to me. Number one right now is most likely heart attack/stroke. The dilemma is a matter of how much time and resources a person puts into defending themselves against various threats, and a matter of weighing the different risks.

    For example: lots of folks are prepared for home-defense by having a loaded shotgun behind the kitchen door. That's great and can be wise. However, if you have little kids around the house, you may determine that the risk of having a loaded gun so easily accessible is a greater risk than not having a loaded gun in the house. It is a matter of prudential judgement and each father of the house needs to make that call on his own. I wouldn't accuse the one who doesn't have a loaded gun in the house of living in a bubble or thinking nothing bad could happen to him - just the opposite he thought that the most likely "bad thing" would be an accidental shooting.

    What I'm trying to ascertain is whether a threat has increased and needs greater effort and preparations.


    "No, crime is extremely low in a small town, and its not a whole lot different than its ever been."

    You seem to indicate that nothing has changed over time. That does not match up with what others are reporting. And it doesn't really explain why my police force has gone from a part-time drug officer to 2 full-time drug officers in 2 years when we have not gained in population.
     
  23. highlander

    highlander Supporter Supporter

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    They’re ruining it here too. I’m not going by race, creed, or religion either.
    When I was a kid, you knew just about everyone on the road you lived on. We shared a phone line with three of them (all my family).
    With each generation, people have gotten less and less respectful, drugs have taken over, and morals have declined. We had an anti-police rally here a few years ago. Some outta towner decided to speak out against the police...His decision nearly ran his business in the ground.
    Yeah, I carry a gun for protection. It used to be common place around here, but no one really discussed it. Heck, if someone had one, you’d never see it out. It stayed close at hand, but well hidden.
    Still is pretty common but now the skinny jeans/flannel shirt wearing, Copenhagen chokin’, pseudo-cowboys like to strap on and flaunt the biggest pistol they can find. Then they walk around like they got a chip on their shoulder.
    Different generation, different time, sad situation.
     
  24. Seacapt.

    Seacapt. Supporter Supporter

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    The biggest thing I've noticed up here in Maine in the last 20 years is everyone had their rifle on a gun rack in the back window but now every one keeps it out of sight.
     
  25. PAcanis

    PAcanis Supporter Supporter

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    Ahh...
    I can't say I keep up with perpetuating that whole North vs South thing either ;)
     
  26. PAcanis

    PAcanis Supporter Supporter

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    First time I've heard of this. Nifty idea.
    But then we'd have people complaining about other folks moving into their state, lol.
     
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  27. PAcanis

    PAcanis Supporter Supporter

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    OK. I hear ya.
    Maybe it IS a South thing. Or maybe it's happening in your area, but other areas of GA aren't feeling the affects yet.

    I can only speak for my area. And there were areas we avoided around here, too. Unless you had the numbers.
     
  28. x39

    x39 Hyperborean Supporter

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    I live in Washington County, Maine. The county is the size of Rhode Island and Delaware combined, population 31,600, one stop light. The poverty rate is 18%. The opioid crisis has hit us hard. There were two murders and several attempted murders committed in our county last year, all by narco-terrorist gangsters from out of state. On a state wide basis, these individual's involvement in major crimes far outweighs that of the citizens who live and are from here. There is no solution, at least not within the bounds of the law.
     
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  29. Birdman

    Birdman Guide

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    Not sure what this has to do with firearms, but I'll add my $0.02.
    Times change, and you can change too. What I mean by that is, don't cry over spilled milk. If you don't like it, go somewhere you do.
    Like Californians dealing with their perverse gun laws. Don't like it? Get out and go somewhere free...
    There, I made it about firearms.
     
  30. TAHAWK

    TAHAWK Guide

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    Around here (NE OH) the meth labs all seem to be in rural areas.
     
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  31. longcruise

    longcruise Scout

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    My.perspective is the opposite of what most of you are observing. I have lived for 40 years in a suburb of Denver. We are nearly contiguous with solid humanity in almost every direction. The town is presently a population of about 120,000.

    Our crime rate is very low. Civic involvement is high. A few years ago we were cited as having the highest citizen volunteer rate per capita in the entire country.

    I worked in the real estate business for thirty years and I remember once selling a home to a lady from new Jersey. She had just retired from a career as a police officer. When I asked her what brought her to Colorado I expected one of the same answers I'd heard before; Climate, the rocky mountains, family connections. But the answer was that statistically the zip code she was buying in was the safest in the US. She had had her fill of crime.

    This is not an affluent community. It's a cross section of old mobile home parks and mcmansions. Some of everything.

    I'm not a social scientist so I don't have an explanation but it shows that there are factors at work that transcend urban versus rural.
     
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  32. riverjoe

    riverjoe Supporter Supporter

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    Our little rust belt city has seen an increase in homicide due to more gang activity but overall crime is about like its always been
    The big difference around here in the little towns 40 or 50 miles out is definitely the meth labs and the crime associated with that enterprise . Just too easy and too lucrative .
     
  33. SilverFox

    SilverFox Scout

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    A little different for me. Lived in a small town for 25 years. However in the last few years drug issues seem to be rampant, big increase in all crimes. Moved to a larger town 30 miles away, few much safer. Still crime, but does not seem to be on the same scale. I think the opioid/herion issues are a big part of the crime issue. Also the small town was slowly dying, no work, plants closing etc. I don't think things are any worse than they every been, you just have more people these days than ever before. The world has always been a dangerous place, you just got to be prepared for anything. I grew up in a small town. We always had a shotgun, with ammo in the gun rack in the hall, located between the bed rooms. Easy access for any family member than might need it. Things are not much different in my home today..
     
  34. Wasp

    Wasp We are GO for Sting! Supporter

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    Not to sound like a SA, but I've never heard of anywhere that was safe enough that you shouldn't be able and ready to protect yourself. There is less crime in small towns with less population, but that less doesn't mean none. There has never been anywhere in the world where crime or some people didn't have the potential to harm someone else.

    As to the drug officers, I addressed that as well with a long explination. And before the Drug officers there were moonshiners (still are and probably live close to you if you are in a rural area), pot growers, etc which have been around doing business and protecting their investments since prohibition. These people didn't just pop up in the rural areas in the last decade and they havent left. If you own enough property you might stumle on a crop, because they'd rather not have it on their property.
    Meth cooks are more recent but have still been around for half a century.

    Crime and threats exist everywhere, crime isn't an urban problem, but again, you are far safer in a small town/rural setting. All of the cases and arrests in your town should be public record, go look through them, ask the cops to stop sugar coating it and give it to you straight, and although they probably will tell you they will also probably tell youyou are relatively safe, and you probanly are, but relative to where? The city? A larger town?

    As to firearms, you can CC a small handgun and barely notice it. Done it most of my adult life as have/do millions of others, even in a small town. And inside the house there are ways to keep your firearms handy and secure from children. Educating them is one, as well as lockers if you are worried depending on their age. If I had kids in the house id be even more likely to have protection and a POA. If you think low crime statistics and a cop across town are going to keep you safe then theres nothing else anyone can say really.
     
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  35. perrymk

    perrymk Supporter Supporter

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    My personal theory, and this is based on nothing other than I think it, is that crime rises exponentially to population. So if your town had 1000 people and 10 crimes per year when you were a kid and now it has 2000 people, you won't have 20 crimes, but rather more likely 40 or 50. Not exact numbers but hopefully my point is made. It has to do with roaming territory and population density.

    It's the same with animals. If an animal needs 1 square mile to roam and meet its needs and suddenly it has to share with two other animals, well, something has got to give. They won't get all just get along.

    It's my theory and I like it. I might change my mind tomorrow so I'm not concerned with whether anyone agrees today. :)
     
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  36. x39

    x39 Hyperborean Supporter

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    I think that in the big picture you're right, but in point of fact, the population where I live has declined 10% over the last thirty years.
     
  37. drobs

    drobs Guide

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  38. PeterCartwright

    PeterCartwright Guide

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    I think most of us can see societal changes which are not in the best interest of the country. This won't be accepted by everyone, but I'll say it anyway: There used to be a broad consensus around a value system based on Judeo-Christian tradition. I would argue this consensus was the "glue" that enabled us to cohere even after events as traumatic as the Civil War. That consensus no longer exists. Personally, I don't think the democratic republic established by our founders can function without it. The system envisioned by founders assumed significant levels of self-control as a necessary requirement for freedom. The symptoms of societal breakdown which have been cited above are symptomatic of our national abandonment of that consensus. Bottom line: bad things can and do happen wherever we live and wise people plan accordingly.

    PC
     
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  39. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Scout

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    That's part of my question. Is it even possible to "go somewhere you like"? If what I'm observing is a change in our culture - then the problem is coming to every small town. And moving to some place you like will not fix the problem since the problem will likely be there too.

    It relates to firearms (as I stated in post #11) because if relocating is not an option then concealed carry is, as well as other things that would need to be done.
     
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  40. Birdman

    Birdman Guide

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    Depends how far you want to get away. There are plenty of places in this country to get away from people. You'd either have to have some type of e-commerce business for income or live a substinance lifestyle, but all is doable. My wife and I's plan is to move in about 10 years and move way out. Our current house will become a rental, and we'll more than likely go the substinance route.

    ETA: The town I live in has about 12k people compared to 5000 when i graduated highschool. We still have very low crime rate. 80% lower than the state's average. However, being the "Gateway to Mt. Hood" it's getting very popular and with the weekend tourist traffic I know in 10 years I'll want out, so I'm planning accordingly.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2018
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  41. slysir

    slysir Guide

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    ^^^Yes!!^^^ When the "progressives" started removing religion and a strong family unit things started to go down hill!! Teaching morality means that you will pay a price for doing evil, whether your caught today or pay in the afterlife. Integrity is doing what's right even when no one is watching!! That concept is no longer PC. It kept a lot of people on the straight and narrow. If you believe there is no GOD then there's no reason to worry about karma. Forget the family, forget religion, the government knows best. BULL!!

    -John
     
  42. Toytech

    Toytech Scout

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    It used to be socially acceptable to correct other peoples bad behavior , that is shaming now and is frowned upon . Showing up to the same place every week and seeing everyone you know and having everyone know you was good motivation to keep it clean during the week , or at least quiet at home , thats mostly gone now too . Now im not religious and i dont go to church , but i do see alot of benefits of having social gatherings like church used to have . Almost all the rural farmers i know , even in very safe areas have a 12 guage handy , for pests or other needs just because they are usually a long drive from law enforcement and are remote so its easy to not be noticed if you are up to no good.
     
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  43. LongChinJon

    LongChinJon Guide

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    My experience in small towns and rural areas is that drug crime is high. In a North Texas town with two traffic lights and a Dairy Queen where we stayed a few years back, oilfield companies were paying high wages, and they still could not keep their crews fully staffed due to random drug tests disqualifying large numbers of workers. Drugs aren't the main cause of crime, but they sure seem to exacerbate every problem around. It was a small town in the country, but Meth was a big issue. I imagine now opiates are bigger.
    In short, while your town may be worse off now than it used to be, I think you will find the same thing in most small towns.
     
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  44. TrespassersWilliam

    TrespassersWilliam BCUSA Friend Bushcraft Friend

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    Did they build a prison nearby?

    Prisons tend to draw urbanites out to be near locked-up loved ones.
     
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  45. stingray4540

    stingray4540 Scout

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    The population is growing and spreading out. Western states like to just blame Californians.
    Sure, Californians are expanding out, but so are urbanites from their own cities.

    There’s not really much you can do about it other than find an even smaller town and hope it takes a decade before people start expanding to that town.

    Talk to local officials, identify what you want to preserve and make laws that prevent transplants from changing your laws. Unfortunately you can’t regulate culture, though.

    I don’t live in a small town, but I’ve witnessed this in my favorite camping spots and in the mountains/wilderness in general.

    As far as drugs and drug crime goes though, I’ve often found that there is a bigger drug problem in rural towns than the cities. Or maybe it’s harder drugs vs softer drugs?
    Well, it’s just antidotal, but I’ve lived in both big cities and a small town and have friends in small towns. I’ve known and heard of more kids destroying their lives on stuff like meth in the small towns, while just about everyone I know in the city smokes pot but lives a normal productive life.
    I’m not saying your problems aren’t drugs and drug crime, only that it may be more complex than that. Things you’ve noticed are influx of cultural outsiders, possible prostitution ring that led to a murder, increased drug use due to need of more officers.

    What does your town have to offer youth as far as entertainment goes? What is your community doing to help keep them busy and uninterested in drugs and criminal activity? Do you still see kids doing what you were doing growing up or are they all inside playing video games/Facebook/forums?
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2018
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  46. 1911srule

    1911srule Scout

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    We live in a rural setting and have a serious drug problem throughout the region. I had naively thought the police were aggressively going after drug people. Until a family member became a cop and he too was surprised at the attitude from other police on the subject. They do not do proper vehicle searches when PC is met, nor have any desire to aggressively go after drug people. Instead are content to sit out their shift parked some place or sitting in dispatch waiting on a call, vice using pro active policing. There are unwritten lists of "untouchables"(IE; Firemen, town council members and extended family, ect, ect). Mostly low pay and the red tape paperwork involved. I'm not placing blame solely on them. Its all of our fault for not demanding action or at least voting people into office who are tough on crime. The people who approve pay for the police (town council) don't want anything more than an appearance of policing imho. Our State cops do a good job, they have the money and support. They also weed out bad cops which is important. So if your rural, go to town hall meetings , emphasize support for police and vote. If your local cops suck, get them outta there. Heck write the State attorney generals office and lodge a complaint. Social media does not help when all the anti law enforcement dirt bags second guess every action taken by police. Political correctness and complacency have devoured our country, but it can be turned around imho..
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2018
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  47. Mannlicher

    Mannlicher Guide

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    Mayberry died a long time ago.
     
  48. JAY

    JAY Guide

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    At my favorite trail head, It's a common happening to see a drug deal going down. Is it wrong. Yes, Do i report it, No. Even If I felt it was a right thing to do to report on the area, I have no idea if the people there are related to county officials, Etc. which could make me a target.
     
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  49. mtwarden

    mtwarden roaming the Big Sky Supporter

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    I trail run with my little 9; we have a transient population that increases when winter subsides- they will often make camp near our local trails

    we also have some local druggers that have learned that they can smash a window of a vehicle at the trailhead and grab stuff quickly and get away (happened to my wife's car)
     
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  50. 1911srule

    1911srule Scout

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    I never go anywhere unarmed anymore. I think crime is worse than ever just the numbers don't show it...the same people who fudge our unemployment numbers, go figure...
     
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