rbinhood
Bushmaster
We can agree that we aren't going to agree on most anything. Let's leave it at that.
Gas and fuel prices.
- Thread starter gohammergo
- Start date
obijohnkenobe
Guide
That's fine. But facts are facts. Anyone see Trump sitting behind the controls on a B2 or B52, setting the GPS coordinates and then pushing the button in the CIC on a DDG? Obviously not, because it didn't happen. The exact targets chosen are done at the CENTCOM level, and we both know there was no order to target a school.
The problem we have in this country is that people state nonfactual opinions as facts, and then make decisions on that. This is what leads a teacher who lives at home with his parents and practices Christianity to believe that the perjorative labels put on political figures are expressions of fact instead of ad hominem propaganda.
Smart people have an obligation to use their intelligence, instead of being influenced by propaganda. I'll tie this to preparedness: no one can be prepared if they rely on emotions instead of facts.
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rbinhood
Bushmaster
I don't know that. If you have the targeting directives for our cruise missile that destroyed the school and killed the people in it, please post them? If you don't have that information, then you don't know who ordered it or how the order read. Who ordered it and how the order read are facts, the same facts you claim are so desperately lacking elsewhere. We are talking about a person who just recently threatened to wipe the entire Iranian civilization off the face of the earth (Fact-He posted it on his Truth Social). While I agree there are some despotic people in Iran, I also think there are many good people in Iran who would be killed if all of the people in Iran were killed. Killing an entire populace is called genocide and it is a war crime under the Geneva Convention. Duterte ordered the killing of thousands of people in the Philippines and thought he could get away with it until he was arrested under a warrant issued by the International Criminal Court in the Hague. He now will stand trial for his crimes. Some people in the current regime in the U.S. may eventually find themselves subject to a similar fate. The Commander in Chief can't run from the responsibility of being Commander in Chief because the responsibility for what happens in the war that he started (without congressional approval) ultimately goes uphill. Eventually the dust from this charade will finally settle. I'm going to wait to see what happens when the Fat Lady finally sings.
Seeing conflicting reports on this. No matter, though.
Definitely agree. If an Edison pickup conversion kit turns out to be cost effective, I'd consider converting my truck.
The school was bombed, either negligently or by chance, but it was bombed by our side. About 100-200 children were killed. Not owning up to that or acknowledging this fact is both cowardly and inexcusable… Turd polishing this atrocity groups you into it.
*ZAP*
Tracker
If you have targeting directives-orders that show the school was intentionally targeted by the USA please post that.
Does it really matter where Iran knowingly puts its own civilian schools (within a military base/complex, as far as I can tell) and uses their deaths to put the US and Israel in a negative light, when the Iranian Republic Guard Corps and their militias have killed anywhere from 6,480 to upwards of 36,000 Iranian civilians for protesting?
And in keeping with the thread; gas is holding steady at $4.49 at my preferred station in Albany, Oregon..with Costco still at $4.45 and other places $4.59 or more. No signs of price reductions even though oil prices are coming down.
Can you clarify your rationale? You seem to care about protester deaths, but not school children. Shouldn’t you care about both?
Why should one care about either, if the goal is to make sure Trump loses?
If the goal is to stop the IRGC and liberate the people, why are politicians preventing going all in, on war, to completely destroy the political power and military power of the Islamic Republic?
To be sure, yes I'd rather far fewer civilian deaths, but when the Iranian regime have no problem with using civilians as shields and killing their own people just to stay in power.... Then it seems total war really is the only answer and the US and Israel should toughen up and accept that there will be civilian casualties regardless of how clean the targets should be.
Honestly.... The Iranian massacres should be a clear signal that the regime isn't going down any other way except complete annihilation, and that the media and rest of the world should just shut up and let the US and Israel finish the job. But clearly that ain't gonna happen.
So. Blame and hope Trump lose for a missile that struck a human shield, or accept that it's war and these things happen, and go all in on defeating, annihilating the regime in power there? Or just stop short and let that regime rebuild and come back stronger, for another 40 years of jihad against the US? I know which way I'd prefer.
You’re doing a lot of political whining. You seem to forget that the Republicans have the WH, House, and the Senate.. and the SC. Pretending to be a political victim isn’t a strong position for Republicans. It’s a weak look.
If you are trying to frame this war as some sort of humanitarian mission, the US administration certainly has forgotten this. Seems like this whole war began because Trump lost his patience with negotiations, regarding Iran’s nuclear ambitions, while falling victim to Bibi’s wishes. Unfortunately the war has been a cluster mess, diplomatically and strategically; because there was little to no coalition building, vague end goals, and wishful thinking that an uprising or some sort of Venezuela type regime switch would occur. It was a gross miscalculation and an expensive one. Luckily the US has the greatest military in the world and tactical superiority, regardless of how pathetic the war strategy has been.
No regime has ever been changed solely due to an air campaign on the mainland. So we’ll either settle for a deal that looks a lot like the one Trump backed out of with Iran in 2018 with the current regime (without getting anything in return), or we’ll again be in the forever war/nation building business.
…The energy crisis from this war of choice seems to be here to stay, high gas prices and all. This is all while the cost of living is shooting through the roof.
I'm saying that politicians regardless of who's holding what majority or minority, are simply not letting Trump go full total war on Iran. The Republican Party is not a monolith. It's fractured. And weaker than it looks.
And you can't just say the "high" gas prices are all the fault of Trump or the Federals. It is not. Also, can't point to any one specific party for pricing either, since both blue and red States have a share of highest and lowest gas prices. If it was, it would be uniformly high across the nation, but clearly it isn't. Middle Eastern oil was only about 8% of the US oil imports, as of April 6th, 2025.
Edit. The gas price graphic is from October 2023, 3 years ago. It is interesting to note how similar the prices are compared to current reports
And you can't just say the "high" gas prices are all the fault of Trump or the Federals. It is not. Also, can't point to any one specific party for pricing either, since both blue and red States have a share of highest and lowest gas prices. If it was, it would be uniformly high across the nation, but clearly it isn't. Middle Eastern oil was only about 8% of the US oil imports, as of April 6th, 2025.
Edit. The gas price graphic is from October 2023, 3 years ago. It is interesting to note how similar the prices are compared to current reports
rbinhood
Bushmaster
That's not my burden. I made the true statement that I didn't know what was targeted or who gave the order. I think the fact the U.S. bombed a school as part of a war he gave the ok for is beyond dispute.
*ZAP*
Tracker
That is funny stuff. Tds is your burden and actual truth is not within your grasp.
I know you’re only a few weeks into membership, according to your join date, but political name calling isn’t tolerated well here. It generally ends with the member being banned and/or a thread being shut down. Much better places on the Internet for that kind of thing.
*ZAP*
Tracker
Thank you for the advice. It is difficult to avoid responding to someone who quotes me and turns the very positive thing of the potus effectively saving 8 women from being executed with lies about the potus. Then hiding behind some bizarre rational.
In the future I will content myself with the absolute fact that Donald Trump won the 2024 election decisively. Winning every swing state and steer clear of such members.
rockett88s
Guide
These seem to be the least biased reports as far as the bombing of the School in Minab goes. Terrible tragedy, likely by a US launched Tomahawk Missile, several of which had been launched at the Naval Facility. Yes... terrible tragedy. Not a war crime though , as the school was not deliberately targeted. and official Islamic State reports and numbers rarely have any sort of semblance to the real numbers. Obama was at the helm when a Wedding was bombed. US civillians were killed there. Did anyone call that a war crime? Yep... More than a few Republicans did. Wars are full of "Gotcha " moments and one side of the aisle will always try to use those against the other side to score political points. It is a despicable act of cowardice when politicians make such accusations. I give civillians who post online a little bit more leeway, especially those who just seem to be looking for a reason to openly hate on Trump, or Obama , or Biden, or the Bushes.... it's just not a good look. And it leads to massive whining and gnashing of teeth... not to mention wild flights of fancy and seriously misrepresented "facts" being spewed about. Then the buttrash kicks into high gear and the thread gets shut down again. I kinda hate it when the whining of a minority of posters gets a pretty good thread shut down...
My thoughts and prayers are with the Iranian people.... who are distinctly different than the Islamic State... I am praying for the Islamic State leaders, too... As well as the leaders of the US and Isreal.... May they all be open minded towards the will of God The conflict to disembowel the Islamic State is a horrible and horribly complex undertaking. I believe that crushing the Islamic State past the point where they will ever be able to reconstitute is essential for any sort of lasting peace in the middle east. And I believe that President Trump is doing more to facilitate that destruction then the last 47 years of presidents has even come close to attempting. I think things will probably get worse and more desperate, and gas prices will reflect that uncertainty for at least the next couple of months. I do think that Trump has positioned the US economy, especially the energy sector, to be better positioned for a recovery after this ride settles down.
Studying Kondrateiff Wave Theory, I also think that our economy has been propped up by printing money out of thin air for so long that there will be an unavoidable correction coming soon.... maybe shortly after the next mid term elections. I think that if the Republicans lose control of either or both houses of our legislature, Then Trump will have a seriously difficult task trying to mitigate the effects of the coming depression. The Great Depression lasted 10 years.... I am not aware of anyone in either party, who is a likely candidate to replace Trump, who has the economy building credentials to handle taking the reins during a depression.
I already liquidated all of my savings plans, and used the funds to by durable goods that will see me well into the next phase of my retirement.... that's the one where I head far enough out in the woods so that the dissolution of our once great land just kinda drifts by and ends up way down river somewheres.... Maybe that'll improve the fishing out there in the woods a little bit???
Just the musings of a confused curmudgeon....
obijohnkenobe
Guide
The school was supposedly hit by a Tomahawk cruise missile. There is uncertainty if it was hit by a cruise missile or a malfunctioning Iranian SAM, and if hit by a US cruise missile if the missile was damaged by anti-air fire from Iranian forces... or if the building was a school or was recently repurposed. We do know that Trump did not personally instruct CENTCOM to target this particular bulding. We don't know, but we do know that we cannot take anything Iran says as factual without independent verification. BTW we know Biden personally approved the bombing of an innocent Afghan family after the attack at Abbey Gate during the Afghan withdrawal debacle that killed 10 innocent people... where was the outrage?
So, if it was accidentally hit, that's bad. But if so, this is not an atrocity, it's an accident of war. Unlike real atrocities, like the Iranian government murdering 20,000 to 40,000 of their own citizens earlier this year because they dared to protest. You see, we have all these "No Kings" protests here in the US and they work because we don't have a king here in the US. The last king we had massacred people for protesting and for standing up for their rights, back in Boston before 1776.
So, not accepting "facts" from Iranian officials is prudent, not cowardly or inexcusable. What's the word for always taking your country's adversaries' word over that of your own government? Or libeling a person who has been repeatedly investigsted but never charged, and in fact cleared, of the crimes that you accuse him of? And what responsibility do the people who continue to smear that person have for the repeated assassination attempts against him?
1. International investigations point to the US being responsible for the Iran school bombing.
2. The US starting a war of choice was not done to “save the protesters”… You are allowed to be disgusted by both the US’s negligence in killing the school children and Iran killing protesters. In fact, both should be disturbing.
3. You getting defensive regarding Trump (coming across as having your feelings hurt because you think people are being unfair to him) is certainly separate from discussing “facts”. I’ll leave it at that.
stonethegardener
Scout
And oil prices continue to rise. Brent at $109.00+ per bbl. this morning....
www.bbc.com
Oil prices rise as US-Iran peace talks stall
President Trump said the US had cancelled plans to send a team to Pakistan for negotiations.
www.bbc.com