The Modern Fighting Kit/Loadout + Gear


Panzer

Panzer

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Original post has been deleted since in devolved into a pile of crap. :) This post is about building your kit and what you use. Looking for ideas on what everyone has put together with regards to bugging out and having gear that supports that mission along with any weapon considerations.

This info is from forum member Jayclimber and I found it to be a great base to start this discussion:

EDC... This is just your basic everyday carry items like CCW, pocket knife, first aid, light, etc...

1st line... This, for most, will be some sort of belt kit which is designed to support your sidearm and rifle., think of this as your primary work station. So you're looking at 1 to 2 pistol mags, 1-2 rifle mags, TQ, IFAK, defensive knife, and possibly a small general purpose pouch for things like a multitool, headlamp, energy bar, spare cordage, etc...

2nd line... Now comes a chest rig of some sort or even plate carrier (armor), your needs may vary... This can and will supplement your rifle and admin needs. This setup will vary greatly based on your needs. Essentially additional rifle mags, comms, additional TQ, small booboo kit, maps, compass, maybe smoke, sharpie/pen/sm notebook, chem lights, optics, etc...

3rd line... This finishes the tiered setup with some sort of sustainment kit. Usually a pack of varied sizes for carrying food, water, shelter kit, sleep kit, foul weather gear, batteries, socks, more ammo, personal hygiene kit, firearm cleaning kit, camo, etc.... Alot of this is to live out of and to fulfill any mission oriented requirements that you might have.

I put together a list years ago to work from in creating a full "Minuteman" kit of sorts:

Rifle
*AR or AK would be the norm but any 5.56 or 7.62 semi auto would be of benefit to any group!
*7 magazines for a total of 210 rounds
-Sidearm
*3 magazines (personal preference for what you carry)
-Extra Ammo
-Weapons mounted light for rifle
-Firearm cleaning kit
-Fixed blade fighting knife
-Folding knife/Multitool
-Tomahawk/Hatchet
*I wouldn’t dismiss the utility of this item, whether as a weapon or tool for creating a shelter or even a creative trap/diversion for the enemy...
-Shovel/Entrenching Tool
*Once again, the utility for creating a fighting position, digging a dakota fire trench, and digging a cat hole...

Armor
*If you plan on getting into a gunfight then I think armor is a must have, I would include a helmet… Head protection can be anything from ballistic protection to a bump helmet, protecting your thinking tool may be one of the most important things you do!-

Battle Belt
*1st line layer with sidearm, mag pouches for both sidearm and rifle, knife, IFAK, flashlight/headlamp, compass, map, water, fire starter, chem sticks, etc….
*Everyones specific needs and layout may differ*

-Chest Rig/Plate Carrier/LBE/Load Bearing Vest…
*2nd line layer with armor, additional mag pouches, comms, and water...
-Day Pack/Sling Bag/Hydration Pack
*There are styles that will attach directly to LBE’s and Chest Rigs or Plate Carriers)
-Operating Pack (30-40 Liters)
*3rd line layer(This would be for extended operations… Worn in place of the hydration carrier or day pack. Room enough for group gear, personal gear, spare ammo, bedroll, stove, rations, water, etc...
*(This pack would vary in size for your use… Most packs in this catagory will have hydration sleeves built in, compression straps for snugging it down if it isn’t filled to capacity, removeable internal frames, MOLLE straps, plus extra compartments for organization… Military surplus is great, plus some private companies specialize in operator style packs such as Eberlestock, Karfu, Hill People, Tactical Tailor, Mystery Ranch, Arcteryx, etc...plus there are many “tactical” styles on the market (Condor, Rothco,, etc..) that will definitely suit these needs!

Communications Equipment
*Multi-band, 2-way radios would be the norm, Baofeng (All around #1), Motorola, etc...

10 Essentials
*1st aid, knife/paracord, map/compass, fire starting equip, water, food, shelter, warm clothes, rain gear, flashlight/headlamp…*(A Minuteman should never be without these 10 items)*

First Aid (IFAK)
*Tourniquet, clotting sponges, Israeli Bandages, chest seals, nasopharyngeal airway, triangular bandage, SAM splint, eye bandages, burn pads, nitrile gloves, tape, saline syringes, antibiotic ointment, blister care/moleskin, aspirin, booboo band aids, suture kit, antihistamine, trauma shears, sharpie, wet wipes, alcohol prep wipes, etc...
*Team Medic will have additional items*

Stove and Fuel
*(Small canister fuel option like the JetBoil series or MSR pocket rocket are quick, quiet, and efficient! Multi fuel options are great for heavy use, 3rd world locations, and extreme cold climates. They will burn everything from white gas to both unleaded and diesel fuel, kerosene and even jet fuel! Options like the MSR XGK are workhorses, just heavy and bulky… Or small emergency stoves like the Esbit and solo stoves that use fuel tablets or natural combustibles are a great lightweight, simple option! Remember, we are not cooking gourmet meals, simply boiling water (maybe even melting snow) for a dehydrated meal or quick coffee and tea!

Water/Water Treatment
*This is obviously your lifesource, 3 liters per day per person is a good rule of thumb...Hydration bladders, collapsable water bottles, Nalgene or Klean Kanteens, take your pick! No excuse not to have water…
*(Filters like the Sawyer mini, lifestraw, or pump style like the Katadyn Hiker or treatment options such as iodine or chlorine tablets

Shelter
*From a basic survival tarp, Bivy sack, space blanket to a hammock to a traditional tent, this choice will vary on season , AO, and mission… Keep in mind, you’re not out to set up a cozy camp and tell ghost stories… Quick setup, quick takedown, low profile and low visibility should certainly be taken into consideration!

Sleeping Bag/Pad
*Poncho liner, Snug sack, fleece/wool blanket, LW sleeping bag, etc… Closed cell foam pad, lg enough to go from you hips to your shoulders. Depends on the season, AO, and mission…

Food
*Energy bars, GORP (trail mix), nuts, jerkey, SPAM, MRE’s, dehydrated meals, etc… Easy to eat on the go items… Avg of 2,000 calories a day is the norm so set yourself up for being able to sustain yourself…

MISCELANEOUS GEAR
-Gear repair kit
-Personal hygeine kit
*TP, Wet wipes, sanitizer, sm pack towel, foot powder, bug repellant, sunscreen, etc…
-Chem sticks
-Flares/Strobes
-Solar Charger
-GPS
-Burner Phone
-Optics
*(I would include Binoculars, Monoculars, NVG’s, Therms, etc in this catagory…)
-Camera
-Protective Eyewear
-Camo Netting
*(For hideaways, sniper veils, encampments, etc…)
-Climbing Rope, Webbing, Carabiners
*(100’ rope & 25’ of webbing for a Swiss Seat and assault line)
-Notebook/Pencil/Sharpie
*(Taking notes while on patrol, sketching enemy camps, details of movements, etc…)

CLOTHING
(This is a full overview of clothing and layers and what the “Modern Minuteman” chooses would be based on the season, AO, and mission requisites)
-Underwear (quick dry)
-Long Underwear (Poly Pro or Merino Wool)
-Pants (This will obviously vary, depending on climate and season)
-Short Sleeve Shirt
-Long Sleeve Shirt
-Insulating layers (such as power stretch fleece tops and bottoms, LW sythetic filled pullovers or jacket, Down jackets/parkas for extreme cold climates/conditions)
-Outerwear (Waterproof/Breathable shell jacket and pants, Soft shell technology is huge today and is almost 100% WP and a lot more breathable than Gore-Tex, plus the fabric is much quieter)
-Socks (Synthetic or wool with optional liners to help with blisters and foot rot)
*I’m a huge supporter of the 3 pairs of sock rule, 1 on your feet, one pair that you just had on, and one pair to change into and you rotate!
-Gloves (Working gloves (tactical shooting gloves) that you can manipulate all your gear with are a huge bonus, plus lightweight liners and warmer gloves/mittens (they make mitts with trigger fingers) for colder conditions)
-Headwear (Wide brimmed Boonie hat, billed cap, Stocking cap or watch cap, and a lightweight balaclava) (helmet is listed above with the gear)
-Footwear (Proper fitting boots are of the utmost importance, choose something with ankle protection but are relatively lightweight! Arch support is a must, remember, your feet are supporting not just your body weight but now an additional 30-50 plus lbs…
 
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This part of the post would be most relevant to me.
I live in a secluded area north of a small town in MT. My neighbors are on similar small acreage and are of a similar mindset.
All have wells, preps, and are equipped for repelling boarders...not hordes, mind you, but roving groups bent on mischief.
We range in age from late 50’s to mid 80s and are all basically sound if a bit high drag, low speed. All are hunters and woodsmen to an extent.
My kit would resemble the list above with a couple of additions:
A .22 suppressed bolt rifle
A suppressor for my AR
A camo smock for winter snow and one for the rest of the year in subdued tan, brown, and green.

My kit fits into a three day bag and is designed to get my wife and Ito a distant part of our “development”to another neighbors place.
Our idea of defense is attrition, not pitche firefights. Plenty of young folk around that can and will tackle that. We are blessed with a large contingent of recen vets, retired military, and retire LEOs. We also have three doctors, several nurses, an excavation guy, a well guy, several contractors that have built many of the homes in this area, and several good mechanics. The area to the south and west is made up of cattle and horse ranches.
Long story short, enough lightweight gear to get to caches and shelter, time to regroup, then pick them off without a massive firefight.
If all that fails, we have lived good lives...
Location, experience,seclusion, and needed tools will work better for us than battle rattle.

Looking forward to non-argumentative posts...
I am aware that someone’s LWRC or DD AR is better than my AR...



Rifle
*AR or AK would be the norm but any 5.56 or 7.62 semi auto would be of benefit to any group!
*7 magazines for a total of 210 rounds
-Sidearm
*3 magazines (personal preference for what you carry)
-Extra Ammo
-Weapons mounted light for rifle
-Firearm cleaning kit
-Fixed blade fighting knife
-Folding knife/Multitool
-Tomahawk/Hatchet
*I wouldn’t dismiss the utility of this item, whether as a weapon or tool for creating a shelter or even a creative trap/diversion for the enemy...
-Shovel/Entrenching Tool
*Once again, the utility for creating a fighting position, digging a dakota fire trench, and digging a cat hole...
ezra
 
If you are talking to me, with rifle and ammo,and water, 27 lbs. No entrenching tool and 2 spare AR mags, 2 spare Glock 48 mags; I am just getting my wife and I to a more defensible spot with pre- cached ammo, food,Med supplies and reinforcements :4:
We also have snowshoes stashed in a place that would aid us through deep snow in the woods to the alternate location.

ezra.
 
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Sorry @Panzer, I probably contributed to the canning of your earlier post:oops: It had a ton of great info...I'll do my part to keep this on topic...

I need some time to fully devote to my personal kit and philosophy, but it aligns much with @jayclimber, with a few modifications.

I've always viewed my First Line kit as the kit on my person, ala EDC. That has expanded somewhat to include a pistol belt, HPG Kit Bag, possibly a sling bag or small waist pack...somewhere in the 1.5-line of kit:p

While this is fighting gear centric, I also refer to my non-fighting gear in the same categories. I have a few variations of "fighting" gear (over vs. covert), so I'll be subscribing and updating...

ROCK6
 
ezra45 said:
If you are talking to me, with rifle and ammo,and water, 27 lbs. No entrenching tool and 2 spare AR mags, 2 spare Glock 48 magsi am just getting my wife and I to a more defensible spot with pre- cached ammo, food,Med supplies and reinforcements :4:
We also have snowshoes stashed in a place that would aid us through deep snow in the woods to the alternate location.

ezra.
Click to expand...

Thanks Ezra. But I was referring to the comprehensive list from jayclimber.

I ask, because obviously someone will have to make some choices as to what they will carry.

The load out listed above is likely fine if someone is expecting a firefight and expects to return home or to a fortified location. But if the person has an expectation that they are bugging out, there will likely be trade offs.
 
Have I missed the mission duration these kits are being developed for?

It seems some of these have gone beyond a rapid threat response to a multi-day patrol/engagement system.

Maybe I got lost in all the hoopla in the old thread.

I still think the information being shared is good. Maybe I'm not posing my question correctly.

Edited: I think NJStricker is asking a similar question more clearly than I did.
 
ROCK6 said:
Sorry @Panzer, I probably contributed to the canning of your earlier post:oops: It had a ton of great info...I'll do my part to keep this on topic...

I need some time to fully devote to my personal kit and philosophy, but it aligns much with @jayclimber, with a few modifications.

I've always viewed my First Line kit as the kit on my person, ala EDC. That has expanded somewhat to include a pistol belt, HPG Kit Bag, possibly a sling bag or small waist pack...somewhere in the 1.5-line of kit:p

While this is fighting gear centric, I also refer to my non-fighting gear in the same categories. I have a few variations of "fighting" gear (over vs. covert), so I'll be subscribing and updating...

ROCK6
Click to expand...
Your fine my friend. You had lots of good stuff to say and I appreciate the well thought responses.
 
NJStricker said:
How much does all that weigh? 60 lbs or so?
Click to expand...

All the weapons and gear in the initial list are probably over 100 pounds - maybe approaching 200. Just the weapons and ammo are probably 30+ pounds. Water is 8 pounds per gallon, and so on…

When we send soldiers overseas, we send the young, strong ones to carry those loads. They’re professional soldiers, and they get paid to get strong and focus on this. It’s their job. Many veterans eventually have back, knee, shoulder problems from frequently abusing their bodies. I used to get bruises everywhere from straps and gear hanging off of me - we all did. Your body often doesn’t get to recover even from minor pulls or strains - so you just hurt and deteriorate. That’s OK, as long as you don’t quit. The DoD doesn’t care if they break you, because they have thousands of replacements ready to pick up all the gear right where you dropped it. So there’s only so much to be gained from doing things like the military does them.
 
NJStricker said:
How much does all that weigh? 60 lbs or so?
Click to expand...
NJStricker said:
Thanks Ezra. But I was referring to the comprehensive list from jayclimber.

I ask, because obviously someone will have to make some choices as to what they will carry.

The load out listed above is likely fine if someone is expecting a firefight and expects to return home or to a fortified location. But if the person has an expectation that they are bugging out, there will likely be trade offs.
Click to expand...
My full kit including water/food/ammo can range anywhere from 40-70+ lbs depending on loadout, time of year, and any activity specific gear. Much of that is water (3 liters weighs 6.5 lbs), 7 rifle mags (1 lb per mag so 7 lbs there), food I figure 1 to 2 lbs per day, so for a 3-4 day patrol outing you'd be looking at close to 20 lbs just in water, beans, and bullets... Water, food, and ammo could be considered consumables.
 
That list I had put together is to really pick and choose from for what would work best in any given scenario or activity... There are so many factors to take into consideration that everyone's needs and individual kits are going to be different...

Like @goon pointed out about the military, they have alot of mission specific gear that they may be carrying at any given time.

Take these Bundeswehr Long Range Recon Force's...

headerbild-fernspaeher-im-wald.jpg

They've got full LBE's and Patrol packs. They're packing not just their personal kits but mission gear that's gonna include things like radios, observation gear (including binos, NVG's, Thermal), probably 8-10 rifle mags plus grenades, tripwires, material to build blinds, etc... I'd be willing to bet each of these guys is pushing close to 100 lbs in gear...
 
Good stuff @Unistat76 !

I like your layering approach. Holds true to the saying:

Survive from your pockets, fight from your web gear, and live out of your pack

Here is some good, basic reading (for anyone interested) on the layering philosophy for gear...
www.offgridweb.com

Layering Your EDC Survival Gear | RECOIL OFFGRID

An Overview of Line Survival Gear and Layered Preparedness for EDC and Other Emergency Situations
www.offgridweb.com www.offgridweb.com
 
I can't carry wepaons, but realistically I wouldn't add much to my EDC. Which is just wallet, keys, tourniquet, 940-1 folder, cuffs and defense spray.

If legal I'd add a P365 IWB and a small karambit like the Bastinelli Pika.

2nd line stuff would already be in my EDC backpack. I carry a laptop and a few items for work there, but there's plenty of and stuff to sustain me for many days as long as I'm already wearing appropriate clothing for the season. I'm breaking the law a little bit there, but unless I'm passing through a metal detector, who cares.

I'd duplicate the "bug out stuff" in a cache.
 
Kennebago said:
Do USMC mag pouches make the Substandard & Poors index?

Like, what's the best poor-man solution in your opinion?
Click to expand...

I think a lot of US surplus is pretty good. Some of it was even made by well-known brands like Tactical Tailor if you look at labels when digging through it. This PVS-14 pouch was around $6, and holds my office first aid kit just fine. It’s a little heavy though. Also make sure any mag pouches fit polymer mags if you use them. If it’s a shingle type, put mags in each compartment and make sure they come in and out OK.

8FDCFF7A-453B-4967-9A52-8D2D4443BD50.jpeg
 
Unistat76 said:
I have all the best in low-tier budget gear. I'm like the Operator to the Poors, lol.
Click to expand...

Nothing wrong with Budget gear if it works. One of my favorite setups is a replica of my original ALICE gear rig. Less than $50 from Surplus stores for the actual gear itself. Probably less than $1500 weapons and all. I'm nowhere near as effective as I was when I first donned that but I'd still be a headache to deal with if needed.
 
Unistat76 said:
From our very own @jayclimber

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Thats been a solid rig for me! Fits AR mags, AK47 and AK74 mags, FAL mags, HK91/93 mags, etc... You can also pull the med kit and use that pocket for holstering a pistol instead if you wanted to.

Makes for a great "American Partisan" fighting rig...
20210917-104244-1-1.jpg
 
Hoooooraaah Gang...

I missed all the fun in the last post... But i remember thinking to myself , simpler is lighter and lighter is better... Most of my time in Iraq, we only carried our sustainment load, which was primarily armor, water and ammo... Body armor , plates, helmet,IFAK, NVGs 64-72 oz of water , or so, 8-10 loaded mags, and rifle... my issue was an A-2! LOL..... but all that stuff tipped the scales at close to 70 lbs if I remember correctly... Even our foot patrols in and around the Ramadi area (2006-2007) were mostly detached patrols where we drove in convoy to the designated TAOR, conducted mission, and returned to our Assembly Area to remount vehicles and get home in time for hot chow... I frequently operated as an RTO/ FO, and so I'd have to add comm gear and a pistol to the mix... Minus the com stuff and cutting down on ammunition and water that load resembled my load as a SWAT guy... I'm not a small guy... 6'1" and right around 205lbs... but a load like that is a definite encumbrance, especially if I have to conduct delaying or evasive actions against any sort of a determined antagonist. Also, regardless of how good shape an individual is in, actual combat saps both resolve and stamina in a way that most who have not been so involved have a tough time fathoming. With that in mind, If i have to e and e away from my familiar turf, most of my hauling capacity is going to be sustainment supplies rather than fighting stuff... My truck gun is geared more towards hunting and feeding me... so if I have to di di mou from my truck, I'll be grabbing a hunting rifle, maybe two boxes of ammo, my EDC, and an ALICE Pack, Medium, with everything I need to stay warm tonight... If surprised in the night I usually bring my truck gear in for the night...so the stuff I grab will be the same stuff, regardless of circumstance... Also, I always have body armor available... Plates, too... I have it... I keep it close and handy..... one never knows when a situation where that stuff might be essential may pop up... but if I gotta go on the run right know... I don't think I'd grab the body armor... Or if it made sense to me to don the armor, I'd probly be looking for a spot to cache that stuff as quickly as possible.... Body armor is very conspicuous, and makes evasive action much more difficult in any foreseeable set of circumstances outside of a full-on counter attack... and full-on counter attacks are another excellent way to ensure my rapid demise... I have yet to see any sort of counterattack portrayed by Hollywood which bore even a cursory relationship to reality...

It's kind of putting the cart before the horse to consider our E&E load out without some sort of Intell Prep of our battle space.... scenarios where someone just shows up in the middle of the night, and prompts us to grab n go are difficult to imagine. Whether it be foreign or internal invasion/civil strife and unrest, or some sort of environmental calamity, some sort of political unrest, ... I really cannot fathom a situation of such magnitude that fight or flight is my playlist catching me completely by surprise... and if it does catch me unawares, grabbing body armor and a gun will probably hasten my demise, not extend my survivability...

My first 24 hours of E&E will likely be spent putting distance between me and anyone trying to find me... There are several nice E&E routes out of my property... I'm pretty familiar with tracking ops... with and without K-9 support... and I am familiar enough with my area that I'm reasonably certain that I can locate and choose my route on the fly and make it to an area where my familiarity with that area will give me a decided advantage over my pursuit... At this point, I have nothing cached anywhere... and no plans to follow that route... If my AO becomes untenable, my preferred course of action will be to go to ground and head for the backwoods without looking back well before anyone gets a notion to come and check me or my property out.... Whether with my Girlfriend or my daughter, though their presence might compromise my E&E plan to some degree... both are in good enough shape to keep up with my pace... and I'm also certain both trust my judgement enough that when I say it's time to punch out right now, neither will take much convincing...

There it is... my 2 cents worth... LOL.... just my way of thinking...
 
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